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adricar2
19-05-05, 11:11 AM
track day, it seems that it is ok for you to drive in excess of the speed limit , if you are trying out your car ? and of course if you are a policeman.
This makes my 3 points look rather sick as i was caught on a camera doing 48 miles an hour in a 40 . At the time i was unhappy about it , but after a while i had come to the conclusion that i had broken the speed limit and that was the law of the land. however now i am not so sure?
seriously now i need somewhere to try out my new cobra engine, and i am unsure if i can use the M42 at night?????????????
sorry for being so synical.

MetaJacko
19-05-05, 02:19 PM
I agree!
Why is it OK for a policeman to try out his car at 159mph but not for the rest of us!!
(Err...Yep! I got done reacently too :p )

Paul

simon
19-05-05, 04:31 PM
The thing that really pi**es me of about the whole thing is NOT the 159 in a 70 but rather the 84mph in a 30. That is ****ing irresponsible and he should be heavilly peanalised for that alone. The high speed on the motorway is not such a big deal, as he was probably in a situation where most cars were going fast, but somebody pulling out of a side road in a 30 limit would NOT stand much of a chance if they were hit by somebody doing almost 3 TIMES the limit
There are occasions when even 30 is too fast (schools etc)
Simon

simon
19-05-05, 04:32 PM
Good grief, I just re-read my own post.....I am an old f*rt aren't I....

robert
19-05-05, 04:41 PM
The court heard the roads on which Pc Milton drove were deserted at the time of the patrol and that driving conditions were good.

OOhhhhh, thats OK then. I might pop out on the bike later tonight and see if it can do 180mph, as I also need to familiarise myself with my bike.

osgood
19-05-05, 04:49 PM
Good grief, I just re-read my own post.....I am an old f*rt aren't I....Yes Simon I recon you are mate :) :angel: Osgood XXXXXXXX

cefin
19-05-05, 08:16 PM
On a positive note its the first decent road test report Vauxhall have had since Jeremy Fartson became a TV presenter.

Cefin

robert
19-05-05, 08:27 PM
Yeah, didn't realise a Vectra GSI would do 159mph!!!!!!

plod
19-05-05, 08:33 PM
You're all just jealous :finger: :rolleyes:

robert
19-05-05, 08:53 PM
You're all just jealous :finger: :rolleyes:

No, I am disgusted. Excessive speed in a 30 limit is downright dangerous, whatever training you have, and he got off scot free.

Speed on a motorway when there is no traffic about is understandable, but the speeds he was doing through 30 limits is downright dangerous, immaterial of what time of night. :mad:

plod
19-05-05, 09:05 PM
Rob, quite agree, must ahve had a very solicitor. I didn't read all the article and it makes my life no easier as we'll get the complaints fromthe public.

My own big boss got disqualified cos he was doing 87 in a 70.. so it doesn't happen all the time.

Generally Police officers get hauled in court and are made an example of. I myself am in court because we were involved in an accident last year in which someone was killed.

I promise and hope that this is a very odd and disgraceful exception.



Still, I wonder if he video' it?

Andy302
19-05-05, 09:08 PM
Someone, somewhere who is not old bill has to try this defence in court, and soon while the stories still live and it has to be publicised. How can any other verdict be given now? Familiarisation my ****, whats wrong with an airfield?

robert
19-05-05, 09:15 PM
Still, I wonder if he video' it?

Yes, he was caught by his own in car video system.

plod
19-05-05, 09:19 PM
They normally have black boxes in them too. Not sure how far back they go though.

They'd regualrly do horrendous speeds on their driving courses.

smash
19-05-05, 09:36 PM
Still, I wonder if he video' it?

Sequel to "C'etait un rendezvous"............"C'etait un voiture familiarisation, m'lord!" :D

Grease Monkey
20-05-05, 07:08 AM
Well thats completely tarnished my otherwise excellent perception of the police force and the british legal system.




God knows what the country's coming too, I fear the day that perheps we wont even be able to trust the honest hard working politicians who run this great empire of ours.






Nah, who am i kidding? The police and legal system's reputation has been so far down the toilet for the last couple of years they can see light at the other end of the pipe.

simon
20-05-05, 07:25 AM
God knows what the country's coming too, I fear the day that perheps we wont even be able to trust the honest hard working politicians who run this great empire of ours.








Now that's just silly. A politician who is untruthful? never !

Steve
20-05-05, 08:45 AM
The area this "chap" decided to go for a blast is well known to me, and while the deserted M54 is perfectly safe to go for a blast along, the speeds in the approaches to residential areas are nothing short of criminal.

what makes it more despicable is that there are miles of completely rural open good visability roads that are within a few miles of this incident that could have been safely travelled at these speeds.

This officer was not prosecuted because legally you cant prosecute a copper for speeding in the course of his duties, though I would be hard pushed to define that a jolly good blast was part of his duties.

I would cargue, as did his bosses who decided to prosecute, that his speeds did constitute dangerous driving, which is what he was being prosecuted for.

interestingly members of his own force differed in what they considered dangerous driving....one considered his speeds in built up areas dangerous, another did not.

Also noted that this wasnt a 5 min blast. his video recorded hours of excessive speed manouvers, all on tape, and watched by the court.


This type of driving without blue lights, through urban areas, unplanned, unsupervised, should cost this guy his job.

After getting 3 points recently for a poxy 4mph infringement, this type of injustice is really likely to piss people off!

rant over

oglyoodoo
20-05-05, 10:48 AM
Although it is certainly a high profile case and he definately should be kicked off traffic duties for driving so stupidly and recklessly in a 30 limit we should all get it in proportion that this is one isolated but complete prat. You get bad eggs in all walks of life.. Sadly it seems the justice system isn't much better in this instance.

Lets hope his bosses can transfer him to something less dangerous before he kills someone. Now he is above his bosses, who took the initiative to try and prosecute him, and the law, will he drive like most good police drivers usually do?? I suspect not.

In a past life I worked alongside the police for quite a few years including a spell at TVP. The majority I came across, and there were many, were really good responsible guys and then there were the cowboys just like we have all come across. I can remember when I was responsible for the maintenance and calibration of the old original "Peta Meter" Radar speed meters. Remember them??? Two PCs came in to the office "Can you get it fixed by tomorrow" " Why? whats the rush??" "We want to catch *** by Christmas" Hmmm... put that on the shelf till March then! To that pair it seemed like a game.

Although it's one stupid person that did this it will inevitably further reduce peoples confidence in the police and justice system as some the previous replies indicate. No wonder the police don't get the help they need from the public for solving crime these days when you get dipsticks like this on the force.
Maybe we should all write letters to the Chief Constable explaining our thoughts as law abiding and upright pillars of the community...

Denis

plod
20-05-05, 11:07 AM
Whilst I might not agree with the necessity of the speeds, I'mnot sure this and other odd instances can mean we can rubbish the Police Force. We're not even a force anymore, as that is an oppressive term....... We are now a Police service..? Service, also a questioable term.

I would direct complaints at the criminal justice unit and courts. I mean, I imagine some chap bubbled our man up inthe first place....

Grease Monkey
20-05-05, 11:38 AM
I know it's a cliche, but sometimes you have to do what the public expects, rather than what protocol dictates. Its not mob rule, it's the will of the people, and we are a democracy after all. Aren't we?

Take the example of when Di died. Buck palace refused to fly the flag at half mast as she was no longer classed as a royal. Vast amounts of public pressure and the queen eventually backed down.

Same with this and numerous other high profile cases where normal people see someone 'in the business' get away with doing exactly what they got nailed for. (or as with this case, usually far worse)

Perception is everything. If the police force is perceived to be racist or sexist or whatever because of one high profile event it harms the force/service as a whole.

My perception, however biased and skewed by the media, is that coppers spend their lives sitting in laybys catching people for minor infringments of motoring laws because it's easier to catch law abiding people than criminals. When they then get caught themselves, they use insider knowledge to worm out of it.

adricar2
20-05-05, 11:51 AM
greese monkey

i am of the same opinion as you.
another point just look at the sevice you get when you are actually in need? i had to report a break in to my partners house, two officers came out but , the usuall , we are too busy etc.
and they asked as to why she had 80 cd discs ,surely it is not up to them to judge if or not you have 8o cds? there was a rack there that had been emptied of cds.

sorry i am on the soap box again, it may come from living in a large city.

pat b
20-05-05, 12:13 PM
I know it's a cliche, but sometimes you have to do what the public expects, rather than what protocol dictates. Its not mob rule, it's the will of the people, and we are a democracy after all. Aren't we?

Take the example of when Di died. Buck palace refused to fly the flag at half mast as she was no longer classed as a royal. Vast amounts of public pressure and the queen eventually backed down.

Same with this and numerous other high profile cases where normal people see someone 'in the business' get away with doing exactly what they got nailed for. (or as with this case, usually far worse)

Perception is everything. If the police force is perceived to be racist or sexist or whatever because of one high profile event it harms the force/service as a whole.

My perception, however biased and skewed by the media, is that coppers spend their lives sitting in laybys catching people for minor infringments of motoring laws because it's easier to catch law abiding people than criminals. When they then get caught themselves, they use insider knowledge to worm out of it.Adrian I think your missing the point(prob why you not a PLOD.) Baby has a top on with hood and mum has not got tax disk on pram.PAT;);)

robert
20-05-05, 12:36 PM
Whilst I might not agree with the necessity of the speeds, I'mnot sure this and other odd instances can mean we can rubbish the Police Force. We're not even a force anymore, as that is an oppressive term....... We are now a Police service..? Service, also a questioable term.

I would direct complaints at the criminal justice unit and courts. I mean, I imagine some chap bubbled our man up inthe first place....

Paul

I don't think anyone is knocking the Police Service, purely the fact that the system has failed in this and many other instances. If a member of the public had used the same sort of speed, they would have been hauled over the coals.

To use the excuse of familiarisation is not right, and no amount of police training can overcome the laws of physics when stopping distances are involved in a 30mph limit where the speed is over double.

I have a wide range of driving experience and training at high speed and in a variety of situations, is this justification to exceed the speed limit in such an inappropriate fashion?

Lets do a worst case scenario. A chap is at home with his pregnant wife, she starts contractions so they decide to go to the hospital. He starts to reverse his car off his drive, and onto the road. Someone is coming down the road at more than double the speed limit. Speed and distance is notoriously difficult to judge at night, but his experience of his road means he has enough time to reverse out safely. Little does he realise that the car coming towards him is not doing 30-40mph, but significantly more. The net result is either a dead or seriously injured police officer and dead or injured members of the public.

Yes, I know this is worst case, but the sad fact is that it could have happened, and what sort of press would this have brought onto the Police Service.

grandadboats
20-05-05, 01:16 PM
greese monkey

i am of the same opinion as you.
another point just look at the sevice you get when you are actually in need? i had to report a break in to my partners house, two officers came out but , the usuall , we are too busy etc.
and they asked as to why she had 80 cd discs ,surely it is not up to them to judge if or not you have 8o cds? there was a rack there that had been emptied of cds.

sorry i am on the soap box again, it may come from living in a large city.

Not just large cities. Our sailing club had its safety boat robbed of controls etc at midnight. Thew thieves parked outside a neighbours house to load up. He called the police and reported a suspeccted crime taking place. They arrived 2 hours later!! Unfortunately street lights failed at this time and he couldn't get the reg.
Tony

plod
20-05-05, 01:36 PM
Rob,

I bet this scenario has been covered though the parties involved might not have been the same.

I would suggest that if damage or injury had occurred, the result would have been different which begs the question, what does it matter if no one was injured etc..

I shouldn't really comment any further specifically on this matter.

robert
20-05-05, 01:40 PM
I shouldn't really comment any further specifically on this matter.

Paul

I am surprised you did comment, personally I would have stayed away from this one. :thumb:

Wilburn
20-05-05, 01:45 PM
Too right Paul, it is still totally out of order to speed to such an extent and anyone caught doing so irrespective of any one being injured or killed etc. (pregnent or not pregnent) should be delt with just as severely!

What I love about driving Cobras, is there is no need to speed what so ever. Just enjoy the ride and the engine note. If a yob driving an RS turbo pulls up at the lights to race you - let them go. They win the race becuase YOU let them! We all know this :-) So just sit back, feel smug and drive safely.

Paul

jeff
20-05-05, 02:15 PM
I do not think we should be having a go at the police on this one, they brought charges against this officer and once again the courts have let a guilty person off.

jeff

Steve
20-05-05, 02:46 PM
whether this chap should have been nicked for speeding, dangerous driving, reckless endagerment etc is all debatable.

What he did was completely out of linme in an urbanised location........period.

His bosses were correct for not condoning this. I am surprised that there are not specific guidleines within the force controlling the irresponsible use of the vehicle. Surely his actions have brought the police service into disrepute which is enough in itself to have him removed from duty.

At this time the "force" have done the right thing in taking to task a plonker. As the coutts have now failed I can only hope they follow some other sort of internal disciplinary action.

osgood
20-05-05, 07:29 PM
Let me make this situation quite clear to all of you, unless you are of Muslim heritage with rag rapped round your head you cant get away with nothing in this country although it is your birth right being English and your own country, I did not say British as that does not stand for any- thing these days!!!! I cannot believe this shower of S----t have got in again!!!! Just shows what a shower of planks are out there voting!:confused: I have three colleagues ex old bill, and the manner & fashion they are taught to drive in re various courses is nothing short of disgusting, basically a load of pants!!!! Traffic Cops (Traffic!) are not good drivers there taught traffic road tactics are not far short of appalling!! Sorry Paul that is fact! Re track day I have had to re -educate one of these guys re driving on a track day with my car! Osgood:)