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martin_t
02-09-08, 01:34 PM
Hi

I am rapidly aproaching the time for ordering my GD Mk4 body and was totting up the costs (Gulp!!!).
My question is regarding the Compound and full polish that GD offer as a service for the Gell coat body cars. This is aprox 1700 and as much as I'm sure its a great job (having seen how nice Simon Rudman's car looks) I wondered if anyone had done it themselves? I am not even sure what the "Compound" entails, and if it is something that I could make a good job of myself?
Any advice from anyone who has done this would be really helpfull.

Cheers

Martin

lutman
02-09-08, 02:40 PM
Hi

I am rapidly aproaching the time for ordering my GD Mk4 body and was totting up the costs (Gulp!!!).
My question is regarding the Compound and full polish that GD offer as a service for the Gell coat body cars. This is aprox 1700 and as much as I'm sure its a great job (having seen how nice Simon Rudman's car looks) I wondered if anyone had done it themselves? I am not even sure what the "Compound" entails, and if it is something that I could make a good job of myself?
Any advice from anyone who has done this would be really helpfull.

Cheers

Martin

Compound is a pre-polish paste similar to T-Cut but much more abrasive - indeed you would use compound as an initial method of polishing the body and similar to sand papering a piece of wood you reduce the abrasive levels until you get to a smoothness you want prior to then applying a final polish and wax finish.
Like all such things the longer you perform this preperation the better the final wax finish.
Yes you could do it yourself but its a very long winded affair and would be best done using the right tools - do not even consider doing it by hand unless you want "karate kid" style muscles - remember wax on / wax off !!!!

Andy302
02-09-08, 05:18 PM
Hi Martin,

Although nowhere near that stage I have already decided it makes sense to get GD to do this bit of the job, not only do you get the flash lines removed but they also sort the engine bay seam. Has to be worth it! Figure out how much you get paid an hour and then how many hours it will take to do the work, I suspect it wont be far off by the time you've purchased all the compounds and polishing equipment.

TINKA
02-09-08, 05:28 PM
Hi Martin,

Although nowhere near that stage I have already decided it makes sense to get GD to do this bit of the job, not only do you get the flash lines removed but they also sort the engine bay seam. Has to be worth it! Figure out how much you get paid an hour and then how many hours it will take to do the work, I suspect it wont be far off by the time you've purchased all the compounds and polishing equipment.

True but I thought this was supposed to be a hobby not a business :confused:

Simon R
02-09-08, 05:29 PM
Spot on Andy,

GD reckoned it saves you about 70 hours - if you know what your doing! - which I equated would take me at least 700!

And as you said - worth it for the engine bay seam alone:mrgreen::mrgreen:

Mine now looks a bit sorry for itself after all the hole cutting... (dust that is .... not extraneous holes!!)

Cheers,

Simon


Hi Martin,

Although nowhere near that stage I have already decided it makes sense to get GD to do this bit of the job, not only do you get the flash lines removed but they also sort the engine bay seam. Has to be worth it! Figure out how much you get paid an hour and then how many hours it will take to do the work, I suspect it wont be far off by the time you've purchased all the compounds and polishing equipment.

Andy302
02-09-08, 05:41 PM
True but I thought this was supposed to be a hobby not a business :confused:

It is but I have to be realistic, I have precious free time at the moment, I like to spend time with the wife and the job which has thus far funded the project demands many hours of my time in return for those funds, not to mention the house that needs decorating!

I also have to weigh up the potential impact of making a right balls up of it! Its not like you can hide a cock up on the outside.

Anyway as I said it feels a long way to that point :( the blue tarpaulin that currently adorns the project does not need polishing and only cost 19!

TonyD
02-09-08, 06:15 PM
70 hours........Good Grief is the GD body really that rough ?

I thought the mould was relatively new so the flashlines and imperfections shouldn't be bad at all.

"Compounding" is just the process of cutting back the top surface to get a smooth finish and is easily achieved by 1. remove flash lines, a sharp blade can be used to get the worst off, 2. using 800 then 1000 then 1200 grit wet and dry rub the body down, and then 3. finish using Farcla G3, an electric polisher and start with a coarse sponge and and then use a fine sponge. Use plenty of water with the sponge and keep it moving. It helps to have one person operating the polisher and the other spraying with a fine mist of water.

1700 will buy........ well lots, and I'm sure your Mrs would sooner have you out in the garage saving that amount of cash than inside spending it! If you doubt this ask her if she'll pay you 24 an hour for the pleasure of your company.

Cheers,

Tony:-D

Dutch Paul
02-09-08, 10:12 PM
Hi

I am rapidly aproaching the time for ordering my GD Mk4 body and was totting up the costs (Gulp!!!).
My question is regarding the Compound and full polish that GD offer as a service for the Gell coat body cars. This is aprox 1700 and as much as I'm sure its a great job (having seen how nice Simon Rudman's car looks) I wondered if anyone had done it themselves? I am not even sure what the "Compound" entails, and if it is something that I could make a good job of myself?
Any advice from anyone who has done this would be really helpfull.

Cheers

Martin

Are you sure it`s 1700 ?

I`m sure it was less than 1000 + vat when I considered having mine done.

martin_t
02-09-08, 10:18 PM
Are you sure it`s 1700 ?

I`m sure it was less than 1000 + vat when I considered having mine done.

Whoops!! Sorry gents, I can't read my own price list!! the price is 1170 including vat not 1700 as I first said!! Still aint cheap mind you, but I guess It has to be right otherwise the whole car looks bad..........Food for thought I guess!

Thanks

Martin

RichardG
02-09-08, 11:15 PM
Whoops!! Sorry gents, I can't read my own price list!! the price is 1170 including vat not 1700 as I first said!! Still aint cheap mind you, but I guess It has to be right otherwise the whole car looks bad..........Food for thought I guess!

Thanks

Martin


If I knew now how much of my life I'd waste on the engine bay seam alone I'd have exchanged my first born son for someone else to do it.

Trevor
03-09-08, 07:38 AM
The engine bay seam is the one to get done by GD.
The rest of the body is relatively easy once you get into it with a good rotary polisher and you feel a sense of achievement once done. Time consuming yes, but a part of the build process.

Steve
03-09-08, 04:09 PM
I did my engine bay seam, took a couple of weekends to get it right, and i do mean about 10 hours of work and poishing

kesha
03-09-08, 04:32 PM
TonyD is perfectly correct and I have seen both the fiberglass bodies in his garage. There may be some small variations to his proceedures and you are not talking the funny costs that are being quoted in this thread as he so rightly indicates. Maybe 100 or so for a good polishing machine. All of us use this on our boats. I thought this was a club of amateurs doing a self build construction like TonyD with ones individual variations to the final looks. One should not forget that you should specify that you intend to run in Gelcoat to the provider of your chassis as I have seen some bodies with extremly thin to "rub thro'" gelcoat. One warning I would give is to stay away from Polishes with Silicone additives because if you want to spray glass some months later it can cause huge problems with car paints.

steveym
03-09-08, 04:45 PM
Yep i'd also back up the others and recommend you get GD to do at least the engine bay seam :-)

oglyoodoo
03-09-08, 04:58 PM
Clearly some owners are better at some tasks than others. I spent ages with the under bonnet seam and it's not too bad but at the time the weather was cold and the gel just didn't seem to harden properly. I gave up until the weather warmed up the following year. In one place I have rubbed through the gel so I have had some two pack paint matched and will paint that bit. The other problem I had was over a hundred small pinholes. After the experience with the gel I filled these with the 2 pack paint. Would I get GD to sort the body? definately!! I have wasted so much of my limited time, enough is enough. It got so frustrating at one point I nearly gave up on it. At least if GD sorts the body you can get straight on with the more interesting bits. I don't really see getting someone to polish up the body is any different to using a ready made loom to wire things up or buying a ready built engine. Some people are good at body work others are good at electrics or engines. JMHO of course.

Denis

Simon R
03-09-08, 05:35 PM
I thought this was a club of amateurs doing a self build construction like TonyD with ones individual variations to the final looks.

Eh? what makes you think it is not:confused:

Simon

Simon R
03-09-08, 05:40 PM
70 hours........Good Grief is the GD body really that rough ?

Sorry Tony I have inadvertantly miss-informed you - that 70 hours included the self builder fittng / fettling doors, bonnet and boot - hinges and locks.

Cheers,

Simon

Purple AK
03-09-08, 06:11 PM
Clearly some owners are better at some tasks than others. I spent ages with the under bonnet seam and it's not too bad but at the time the weather was cold and the gel just didn't seem to harden properly. I gave up until the weather warmed up the following year. In one place I have rubbed through the gel so I have had some two pack paint matched and will paint that bit. The other problem I had was over a hundred small pinholes. After the experience with the gel I filled these with the 2 pack paint. Would I get GD to sort the body? definately!! I have wasted so much of my limited time, enough is enough. It got so frustrating at one point I nearly gave up on it. At least if GD sorts the body you can get straight on with the more interesting bits. I don't really see getting someone to polish up the body is any different to using a ready made loom to wire things up or buying a ready built engine. Some people are good at body work others are good at electrics or engines. JMHO of course.

Denis
Just to elaborate. No the cold definately won't help. But Gelcoat will never properly cure outside of a mould. It needs to react with the release wax in the mould to cure. What you need to use is Topcoat or Flowcoat, It's the same thing as Gelcoat but it has wax premixed in it so it cures.

ldtopham
03-09-08, 08:35 PM
I gave it a go and almost got it right the first attempt. As with most job's the first attempt is usually your best and this proved so. In the end I just filled the gap with body filler, sanded and sprayed the entire engine bay with 2 tins of colour matched cellulose. Still looks perfect 12 months on and only took an evening to do. I had a step of about 1/4" to blend between the inner and outer tub. Spreading body filler over approx 3" width made a much neater job than I could have using gel coat.

Total cost 20 in paint and maybe a few quids worth of filler and wet and dry. 25 max.

ldtopham
03-09-08, 08:37 PM
One thing to watch with flowcoat/ topcoat is that it cannot be gel repaired ontop of the waxing agent it contains so make sure you get it right 1st time;)

ldtopham
03-09-08, 09:32 PM
Martin. I flatted the complete body with 800/ 1000/ 1200 and 1500 wet and dry. A little OTT but my bodyshell is black and was the last out of the mk4 mould before it was due a service. This minimised the amount of small flaws seen after polishing. Any other colour and I don't think this would have been necessary. Flat the flash lines with 800/1000/1200 and give it a trial polish. If your happy then set too with the rest. I used Farecla G6 and G3 applied using a polishing machine. Finally finished with 3M Finnesse It. I am very happy with the finish. It took about 4 weeks of evenings (approx 60hrs). It is labour intensive but very rewarding to say you have done it yourself (especially when most folk comment on the quality of the paint job:cool:) not least financially.

ldtopham
03-09-08, 09:40 PM
During and after;)

martin_t
03-09-08, 10:09 PM
Martin. I flatted the complete body with 800/ 1000/ 1200 and 1500 wet and dry. A little OTT but my bodyshell is black and was the last out of the mk4 mould before it was due a service. This minimised the amount of small flaws seen after polishing. Any other colour and I don't think this would have been necessary. Flat the flash lines with 800/1000/1200 and give it a trial polish. If your happy then set too with the rest. I used Farecla G6 and G3 applied using a polishing machine. Finally finished with 3M Finnesse It. I am very happy with the finish. It took about 4 weeks of evenings (approx 60hrs). It is labour intensive but very rewarding to say you have done it yourself (especially when most folk comment on the quality of the paint job:cool:) not least financially.

Hi Lee

Got to admit it look Brilliant!! I am going to get mine in black as well. When you are wet and drying it, I assume there is a good thickness of gelcoat for you not to worry about going through?

Cheers

Martin

ldtopham
04-09-08, 06:30 AM
It is more than thick enough in all areas. Just be carefull on any edges as these will 'cut' through the easiest. If you have ever used cutting compound on a painted car you will know how easy it is to break through the paint, the gel can take a load more abuse when polishing which gives us amateurs a little more to play with;)
I broke throught the gel in a couple of small areas and this was done when flatting down where the gel was missing from the flash lines as it was supplied. Although I re-gelled the areas prior to polishing I still broke through but either no-one has ever noticed or they have just been polite and said 'nowt' It's not perfect, but considering the money it has saved me over the factory doing it or a paint job and the ease of maintenance I'm very happy with the results.

Good luck!

dingocooke
04-09-08, 08:37 AM
My neighbour visted GD and they showed him them re gelling an spot/patch where they had cut through; he said the finish was sublime, and the one I saw at Donnington a while back was too; I guess the bottom line on this one is time or money; not many have both!
Looks good Lee!! Like your wheel nut covers do I recall them being Team III?

ldtopham
04-09-08, 11:25 AM
Hi Steve, yes they are Team III. I like the method that they retain the spinners too. It is a tapered center boss that feeds into the wheel centre from the inside of which the part that protrudes past the centre is threaded approx 1". When the wheel is fitted up spin up the spinner tight then for added safety tighten the 3 grub screws around the cicumference. The wheel nut cover is sandwiched between the spinner and wheel;)
The wheels are holding up great to mostly wet weather driving, no laquer and I have never polished them. Just a quick wipe with WD40 as soon as it's parked up in the garage and job done. The brake dust is now leaving them a nice shade of grey;)

dingocooke
04-09-08, 11:52 AM
Really like the look of your TeamIII spinner set up; next time you have a wheel off would you drop me sketch of dims Id like to see if I can adapt to my image wheels? No panic but something i'd like to investigate!

Robin427
04-09-08, 01:24 PM
GD gave me a large jar of gelcoat for filling the engine bay seam with etc. After a small crash I've used it on the wheel arches and with a lot of elbow grease, you can get near perfect results.

Regarding the cost of letting GD do it, the quality of the moulding is pretty good anyway - I did all of mine by hand and although it doesn't match up to the likes of some people's, it's not that bad. If I could be bothered (and if the rain ever stops) I might machine polish it

That said, get them to do the engine bay seam

ldtopham
04-09-08, 05:29 PM
No problem Steve. This image from my gallery gives you more idea of the set-up. Dimensions will follow some time through the winter;) DSCN1526_Medium_ - Cobra Club Gallery (http://www.cobraclub.com/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/1805/ppuser/60)

dingocooke
04-09-08, 05:40 PM
nice one Lee, dims wise Im int in the 'stub axle's dimes just dias and lengths to see if it'll all possibly fit the image wheels with a little work in my lathe! Maybe the covers dims as wellif you get time??

No panic, classic winter job as you say LOL

martin_t
15-09-08, 03:33 PM
Martin. I flatted the complete body with 800/ 1000/ 1200 and 1500 wet and dry. A little OTT but my bodyshell is black and was the last out of the mk4 mould before it was due a service. This minimised the amount of small flaws seen after polishing. Any other colour and I don't think this would have been necessary. Flat the flash lines with 800/1000/1200 and give it a trial polish. If your happy then set too with the rest. I used Farecla G6 and G3 applied using a polishing machine. Finally finished with 3M Finnesse It. I am very happy with the finish. It took about 4 weeks of evenings (approx 60hrs). It is labour intensive but very rewarding to say you have done it yourself (especially when most folk comment on the quality of the paint job:cool:) not least financially.

Hi Lee

Can only agree with the quality of your finished bodywork. Can you advise on which electric polisher you used and sort of cost. The thought of saving a grand, which I could spend on something else is quite appealing!!

Cheers

Martin

ldtopham
15-09-08, 07:56 PM
I dropped lucky on the polisher as I bought it from a club member for 30 in VGC. It's a Sealey ER1800PD 800W 1800rpm polisher. A proper bit of kit, check E-bay there may be some available. If you're ever up this way then you're more than welcome to borrow it.

craigh
17-09-08, 05:07 PM
Silverline 341246 Hi Spec 1200 Watt 6 Speed Trade Sander Polisher & 2 Heads - (http://www.transtools.co.uk/store/prod_146/corded-power-tools/polishers/silverline-341246-hi-spec-1200-watt-6-speed-trade-sander-polisher-2-heads.html)

i bought one of these,it does the job well