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ChrisP
11-08-20, 07:39 PM
I am about to start a complete GT40 rebuild having bought the KVA advertised on this forum a couple of months ago. Anyone in the (Greater!) South Midlands area with experience or with a current car? Thought it would be useful to chat periodically or look at a complete car. I’m looking for the benefit of experience which you can’t beat! Learning on the job is fine but it’s not the most efficient!
I am going to strip the old girl first. There will be a BMW V8 to get rid of if anyone is interested. It also came with a 302 which I intend to put back in.
It’s a complete car but a bit of a state. Nothing that can’t be fixed

kdavies3
11-08-20, 09:04 PM
Loving it Chris.
Keep us updated.
I thought your Son was the main mechanic on this one?

mylesdw
11-08-20, 09:29 PM
Yes, please keep us posted, a build thread would be great.

ChrisP
11-08-20, 09:30 PM
Loving it Chris.
Keep us updated.
I thought your Son was the main mechanic on this one?
He was indeed, but is so busy with his job he has asked me to crack on! His mum is convinced it was all a conspiracy by me to get a GT40 project!!!
Looking forward to it. Should keep me busy through the winter.
I am planning to record the rebuild. Maybe a thread on here.

Murray
11-08-20, 11:01 PM
A thread would be good! I was building one a number of years ago til a knee op put paid to any further progress and I sold it, too impatient to wait.

KevinW
12-08-20, 08:30 AM
+1 for a new build thread please!

I'll be watching, jealously. :)

markharnett
12-08-20, 09:08 AM
Would also love to see a build thread.....a GT40 is on my bucket list, but having only just got the Cobra on the road intend to enjoy that a bit first!

TINKA
12-08-20, 12:25 PM
Another one here who would love to see a build thread

AKCharlie
12-08-20, 03:18 PM
Snake Torque is always wanting good build features which is very often in short supply. This would be an excellent ongoing feature until complete!
Charlie


He was indeed, but is so busy with his job he has asked me to crack on! His mum is convinced it was all a conspiracy by me to get a GT40 project!!!
Looking forward to it. Should keep me busy through the winter.
I am planning to record the rebuild. Maybe a thread on here.

Bannon
13-08-20, 08:02 PM
Oh yes!! I've been waiting for this. Please let this be a build thread!

rpm015
13-08-20, 08:21 PM
Definitely need a build thread so I can torture myself with envy

simon
14-08-20, 08:50 AM
Chris, I presume you’ve been over to GT40s.com to seek advice?
lots of info over there and quite a few UK owners/builders.
A few like me have had multiple GT40 replicas (although I’ve probably had the most)
simon

Chris1
14-08-20, 09:54 AM
I'm sure it is already on the build thread,
but if it's not, fitting air-con is not a bad idea.
I am sure it would not be easy though !
Chris.

ChrisP
14-08-20, 10:04 AM
Chris, I presume you’ve been over to GT40s.com to seek advice?
lots of info over there and quite a few UK owners/builders.
A few like me have had multiple GT40 replicas (although I’ve probably had the most������)
simon

Thanks for that. Lots of info indeed!!!! Another forum to join. Have also joined the GT40 Enthusiasts. They meet fairly locally which is helpful. Just need to sort myself and the workshop out to make room and off we go!
I need to learn how to post pictures properly too!

ChrisP
29-10-20, 09:46 PM
OK, I have started work on the tired GT40 and will attempt to upload some pictures. If there is blank space below, I need to try again!

This is the car, a 1989 KVA body but the chassis has been specially fabricated in stainless steel (I guess a one off)

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39015&stc=1http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39016&stc=1

The body has quite a lot of scrapes. Not sure yet but I will probably get a new MK1 bodyshell

ChrisP
29-10-20, 09:50 PM
And unfortunately the rear wings were adjusted with an angle grinder!

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39017&stc=1http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39018&stc=1

All clouds have a silver lining though, I found the cut off bits under a load of Tesco bags in the front!!

ChrisP
29-10-20, 09:52 PM
The interior needs a bit of love! Mastic is never a good look....

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39019&stc=1

She still looks the business though....

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39020&stc=1

ChrisP
29-10-20, 09:56 PM
And now for the good news! The suspension looks good. Someone spent a lot of time on this. OK, so aluminium carriers would have been better but these will do just fine for now and with some attention and fettling I reckon I can get this somewhere near decent..

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39021&stc=1http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39022&stc=1http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39023&stc=1

Inboard coils on the front

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39024&stc=1

Oh, and that's a big old BMW V8 hanging in the back

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39025&stc=1

ChrisP
29-10-20, 10:05 PM
Tuesday, and she is on the ramp

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39026&stc=1

Wednesday and the mass of wires and that big old BMW motor is out! Anyone want a good German V8?????

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39027&stc=1

One of the most useful tools I made many years ago was a set of forks to fit on the 3 point linkage of a tractor!

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39028&stc=1

The tractor, by the way, is another story. This time last year I split it and had the inards of the 32 speed gearbox all over the floor!! Fortunately I had a man with me who knew what he was doing. Absolutely amazing. He knew every cog and bearing in that box and only looked in the manual once. You have to admire that level of knowledge and skill. We fixed the problem (no high range), popped in a few new cogs and a clutch and put the two halfs of tractor back together. If anyone has ever wondered how you split a tractor you do it using little rail tracks and jacks. Quite a thing to do and much easier on a flat concrete floor!!! Anyway, back to the GT40............

ChrisP
29-10-20, 10:15 PM
As well as the engine, there are masses of BMW parts on this car. I am betting these brakes are BMW too. Anyone know for sure?

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39029&stc=1

Handy to have an outboard handbrake after too many years of inboard Jag discs, grazed knuckles, special spanners and access panels! (Still love the cobra though!)

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39030&stc=1

I'll take some more pictures tomorrow. I have started ripping off the awful stainless panelling, cleaning up the chassis and over welding and polishing some of the suspension arms. I've also split the UN1 gearbox off the bellhousing. Oh, and what a surprise the clutch revealed! Will upload some pics tomorrow..

oldcobber
29-10-20, 10:21 PM
Hi Chris, well at the rate your going I expect to see it on the road in the spring lol. Great to see the picture's, keep them coming. Take it easy.
Bob

aaronjb
30-10-20, 10:44 AM
As well as the engine, there are masses of BMW parts on this car. I am betting these brakes are BMW too. Anyone know for sure?

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39029&stc=1



Definitely ATE brakes, but those have been on a lot of things - Jags included.. the anti-rattle spring is on back to front, but I'm assuming that's because you're part way through disassembly here :) There's something off about the way the caliper is sitting, too, like it's missing or unbolted at the top most slide pin?

IIRC they are an unusual thread, incidentally. M9 maybe, or M7. I had to buy a tap to clean a set up once, I remember that much!

ChrisP
30-10-20, 05:43 PM
Definitely ATE brakes, but those have been on a lot of things - Jags included.. the anti-rattle spring is on back to front, but I'm assuming that's because you're part way through disassembly here :) There's something off about the way the caliper is sitting, too, like it's missing or unbolted at the top most slide pin?

IIRC they are an unusual thread, incidentally. M9 maybe, or M7. I had to buy a tap to clean a set up once, I remember that much!

I think I had already half dismantled it when I took the pic!!

aaronjb
30-10-20, 05:50 PM
That would explain it :)

ChrisP
30-10-20, 05:53 PM
Onward then.........So here is a pic of the UN1 gearbox which was mounted quite cleverly to an adaptor and then to the BMW's bellhousing. The shaft appears to have been upgraded to a big spline. It wobbles though, even when the adaptor plate is secured. I know little about these gearboxes but I do have another one and that shaft is solid! Something to look in to. Maybe another bearing to carry it. It seems odd to rely on the crank bush to hold the input shaft steady. Anyway, I'm not yet sure what I am going to do. Good news though is that it is the 3.44 ratio diff which I am reliably informed is the best one to have!
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39031&stc=1
And the bellhousing
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39032&stc=1http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39033&stc=1
This allowed the UN1 to fit up to the BMW engine

Now for the funny bit. When I took the clutch out I could see the printing on the drive plate as I removed it. New clutch I thought, but look at this....

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39034&stc=1

Centre spline welded in to accommodate the bigger input shaft! Don't think I will be using this.

ChrisP
30-10-20, 06:02 PM
So on to today's work......
There was some pretty nasty welding on the suspension components. Shame, as they are well made and appear to be a good design. I forgot to say that I checked the car dimensionally before I started messing with it and it was good. Needed to tidy up the components though. Started with a set like this..
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39035&stc=1

And eventually got to this which is much tidier. Not sure whether I can be bothered to polish it all up any further but I have ordered a new kit to give it a go.

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39036&stc=1

They certainly look a lot better. Not as good as a lovely tigged up job but will definitely do for now. I am planning to get this car 80% (to my!) standard, get it on the road and then gradually improve it. I am trying to use as many parts as I can to keep the cost down and to frankly avoid waste. It won't look top drawer 'out of the box' but I can always improve it later, tig up suspension, change the hub carriers for aluminium etc. As we all know, there is no end to what you can do or spend!

jon1d
31-10-20, 02:02 PM
Doing a fine job of cleaning those suspension welded parts up. Smoothed out welds look good or nice pooled tig welding can look like art work when done by skilful welder.
I think I would look at replacing those drums for discs as I would want to make sure I have good stopping power with V8 power.
You certainly making good progress. Like the posts and photos.

ChrisP
31-10-20, 02:56 PM
Doing a fine job of cleaning those suspension welded parts up. Smoothed out welds look good or nice pooled tig welding can look like art work when done by skilful welder.
I think I would look at replacing those drums for discs as I would want to make sure I have good stopping power with V8 power.
You certainly making good progress. Like the posts and photos.
Thanks Jon. Agree on the brakes. They are discs though, that’s the handbrake with the shoes which run on the inside of the disc (already removed in the pic).
It will never be a show winner but I hope to make it a decent car. Bit of a head scratcher though. Although the chassis and suspension is well designed there was no thought given to how the panels or body fitted. Particularly in the bulkhead and behind the front wheels. I am having to overcome that! Nothing in the same plane. Means I might have to weld up ally panels to make a decent job of it. Thinking about it now! Needs to be watertight too. Enjoying it though. Sure is making me think!

simon
31-10-20, 03:03 PM
A word of advice if you’re interested.....make the interior as comfortable as possible (sound proofing, nice carpet etc) the GT40 is obviously first and foremost a race car and the deafening noise, heat and rain ingress ( added to the tiny windowflaps) means it very quickly gets ard work and tiresome to drive on the road.Add these things as you’re rebuilding it, you’ll thank me later.....
having owned examples of these, the quiet, more refined cars were used much more than the loud, laity ones.
simon

ChrisP
31-10-20, 03:17 PM
A word of advice if you’re interested.....make the interior as comfortable as possible (sound proofing, nice carpet etc) the GT40 is obviously first and foremost a race car and the deafening noise, heat and rain ingress ( added to the tiny windowflaps) means it very quickly gets ard work and tiresome to drive on the road.Add these things as you’re rebuilding it, you’ll thank me later.....
having owned examples of these, the quiet, more refined cars were used much more than the loud, laity ones.
simon
All advice and experience very welcome! That makes total sense. I have to make a decent job of the inside as the wife is telling me it should be something she can drive! (Not like my cobra!!). She has already chosen red leather! Eek!

kdavies3
01-11-20, 11:52 AM
Chris did you not get a Renault transaxle with the car?
Is it no good?
Or are you going to reuse the existing box with the Ford motor?
Did you you establish if the motor is a 289 or 302?
So many questions. LOL.

ChrisP
01-11-20, 12:33 PM
Chris did you not get a Renault transaxle with the car?
Is it no good?
Or are you going to reuse the existing box with the Ford motor?
Did you you establish if the motor is a 289 or 302?
So many questions. LOL.

Hi Kev, yes, got a spare UN1. That is a lower ratio diff and smaller spline, so I was thinking, if I could, the one in the pics with higher ratio and larger spline would be a better bet. No decision yet! Of course, a mix of the two is a possibility.
Yes, the other engine is a 302 and in fine fettle. I would say done nothing since a rebuild. Will probably add a top end performance kit and get it up to 370hp or thereabouts.
The engine was built well by someone who knew what they were doing.
The more I explore the more the mystery deepens. There are some very well done aspects and some the opposite! Maybe that was a function of the previous owners dementia. Who knows. It’s going to be a long job. I am still finding my way but will get there

jon1d
01-11-20, 01:28 PM
Chris do a lot of research on the cooling system as these tend to be the weak point and cause the most problems for GT40 owner I have seen. I have seen all sorts of catchment tanks swirl pots but still have cooling issues. I think they are fine on the move with air flow its just when in traffic and external temperatures in 30c's get high the front rad struggles.Not a major problem in U.k. but a problem touring in Europe.
I have seen fitting electric water pump seems to improve things.

ChrisP
01-11-20, 02:43 PM
Chris do a lot of research on the cooling system as these tend to be the weak point and cause the most problems for GT40 owner I have seen. I have seen all sorts of catchment tanks swirl pots but still have cooling issues. I think they are fine on the move with air flow its just when in traffic and external temperatures in 30c's get high the front rad struggles.Not a major problem in U.k. but a problem touring in Europe.
I have seen fitting electric water pump seems to improve things.
Yes, I can imagine they are not much fun in traffic. It’s a long way from rad to engine. Will explore on the GT40 forum

ChrisP
07-11-20, 07:08 PM
Not done much this week as the fine weather meant i had to catch upon a few outside jobs. Also had a day out in the cobra which was nice but bloody cold! Have continued to strip the unattractive stainless tin off the chassis

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39039&stc=1

To be fair, it looks a lot better in the pics than it does in real life!

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39040&stc=1

I am going to refabricate in aluminium, probably welded (if my aluminium welding skills are up to it) to make sure I can keep out the water to the front bulkhead.

Finally got there. Damm that stainless stuff is tough and I have more than a few cuts for my trouble!!! It has to go though, it really does not look good. Not to mention the gaps and general untidiness in the way it was fitted originally.

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39041&stc=1

Will now cut and weld some panels and see if I can tidy things up. Will temporarily fix them for now, pending the rest of the strip down.

ChrisP
07-11-20, 07:13 PM
Now this is supposed to be fun, yes? So to hell with logical sequence! I can do whatever I like in whatever order!! Well today I had a spare hour and got out the stainless polishing kit outside in the sunshine. I had a go at finishing a couple of the suspension arms I smoothed up a bit last week. Really pleased with the result. Now I've started I will have to do all of them

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39042&stc=1

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39043&stc=1

That is an amazing difference to where these were before I got out the grinder!! It didn't take that long either.

ChrisP
07-11-20, 07:17 PM
Chris do a lot of research on the cooling system as these tend to be the weak point and cause the most problems for GT40 owner I have seen. I have seen all sorts of catchment tanks swirl pots but still have cooling issues. I think they are fine on the move with air flow its just when in traffic and external temperatures in 30c's get high the front rad struggles.Not a major problem in U.k. but a problem touring in Europe.
I have seen fitting electric water pump seems to improve things.

Looks like a Davies Craig electric pump and digital controller is the way to go. Maybe with a dual pass radiator too. Not that expensive really (!) and a big improvement over conventional set up. I guess I could even go for a triple pass radiator. Plenty of time to make that call. Definitely won't be a standard set up though.

simon
07-11-20, 09:10 PM
Well worth giving Chris Cole a call about the UN1. He’ll put you right!
Simon

ChrisP
07-11-20, 09:14 PM
Well worth giving Chris Cole a call about the UN1. He’ll put you right!
Simon
Yes, that name has come up a lot! Will do that, he seems to be the man

philbrad73
08-11-20, 08:17 AM
Hi Chris, great work. I'd be cautious on the smoothing of the welds. Without knowing how they were welded e.g. weld prep etc. You could be removing a lot of the weld? As these are supension parts, stainless steel is more susceptible to fatigue around the welds, so give them a good inspection. Keep the updates coming 👍

ChrisP
08-11-20, 11:55 AM
Hi Chris, great work. I'd be cautious on the smoothing of the welds. Without knowing how they were welded e.g. weld prep etc. You could be removing a lot of the weld? As these are supension parts, stainless steel is more susceptible to fatigue around the welds, so give them a good inspection. Keep the updates coming ������

I confess that crossed my mind. No real way to tell if he tapered the joints before welding or not! One of those letting go at high speed would not be funny! I shall have to try to test them a bit before reinstalling. I am only really worried about the butt welds on the tie rods, I think the rest will be fine. Just could not stand to see those welds though!

ChrisP
10-11-20, 05:12 PM
Been fiddling again today. Cracked on with the inner wing bulkhead which I have welded up in to one big panel. Still some fettling to do and then I need to sort out the finish (probably just polish it). All a bit difficult when I haven't made a final decision on the body but it is hopefully adaptable, particularly in welded and polished ali. Nothing fixed properly yet. Also tidied up the front suspension.
Pics below - plus one to show where I started!
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39057&stc=1

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39058&stc=1

Hopefully an improvement!

ChrisP
16-11-20, 05:14 PM
The more I do the worse it looks!!!!

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39073&stc=1

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39074&stc=1

If I keep going, at some point it might look like I am making some progress!!

I have decided to go for a new MK1 body and fittings and make it fit this chassis. It would be much easier to buy a complete (designed) car such as a Tornado (their complete kit is very tempting) but it seems such a waste when the basic chassis I have and the suspension looks good. It's just work, hours and money after all! What else would I do?????

KevinW
16-11-20, 06:05 PM
Does that mean the current body will appear on ebay?

ChrisP
16-11-20, 06:15 PM
Does that mean the current body will appear on ebay?
Yes, I guess so. Are you looking for one?

KugaWestie
16-11-20, 07:51 PM
Yes, I guess so. Are you looking for one?

I know someone who might be interested. Can you send me some photos and an idea of what you want for it?

Bannon
16-11-20, 07:58 PM
Mk1 body is the right thing to do. I'm sure it'll need tweaking to fit, but surely it can't be too different...loving the progress!

simon
16-11-20, 08:39 PM
The Centre spider and sills are the same. Mounting points for the clips MAY be different as the MK3 is longer.
While you’ve got it stripped, put in a dropped floor pan with a ramp at the front, you’ll thank me later.....

simon

ChrisP
16-11-20, 09:47 PM
I know someone who might be interested. Can you send me some photos and an idea of what you want for it?
Will dig some out. It’s pretty rough though.

ChrisP
17-11-20, 10:01 AM
I know someone who might be interested. Can you send me some photos and an idea of what you want for it?
Kuga
Actually, if you look earlier on this thread you can see the body quite well. It is repairable, especially by someone who knows their way around fibreglass and bodywork (Like many on this forum). I do have the two slices of the rear arches so they could be bonded back on!

ChrisP
17-11-20, 10:09 AM
[QUOTE=simon;602103]The Centre spider and sills are the same. Mounting points for the clips MAY be different as the MK3 is longer.
While you’ve got it stripped, put in a dropped floor pan with a ramp at the front, you’ll thank me later.....

Can I explore the floor a bit with you? At the moment the car has a flat piece of stainless welded underneath the entire car except the engine bay. In other words the bottom is totally smooth, the sheet being welded under the chassis rails.

I maybe should have checked ground clearance more but the wheels were all wrong. However, the car was sitting very low.

If I understand you right, you are saying to drop the seats below the chassis/floor level to gain a bit of headroom and effectively box around with a slope at the front for the sleeping policemen?

Sounds like you had a car like this??

I am going for a T top so will get a bit of room that way. Don't want to be looking through the top line of the spider though!!!! I'm 5' 11'' btw

KugaWestie
17-11-20, 07:50 PM
Kuga
Actually, if you look earlier on this thread you can see the body quite well. It is repairable, especially by someone who knows their way around fibreglass and bodywork (Like many on this forum). I do have the two slices of the rear arches so they could be bonded back on!

Thanks. I have sent him the photos.
Any idea how much you want for it?

ChrisP
17-11-20, 07:56 PM
Thanks. I have sent him the photos.
Any idea how much you want for it?

He can make me an offer. Probably best to see it first

KugaWestie
17-11-20, 08:04 PM
He can make me an offer. Probably best to see it first

Ok I will let him know. Both he and I are fairly local to you so if he is interested a visit post lockdown may be good to do!

simon
17-11-20, 09:16 PM
[QUOTE=simon;602103]The Centre spider and sills are the same. Mounting points for the clips MAY be different as the MK3 is longer.
While you’ve got it stripped, put in a dropped floor pan with a ramp at the front, you’ll thank me later.....

Can I explore the floor a bit with you? At the moment the car has a flat piece of stainless welded underneath the entire car except the engine bay. In other words the bottom is totally smooth, the sheet being welded under the chassis rails.

I maybe should have checked ground clearance more but the wheels were all wrong. However, the car was sitting very low.

If I understand you right, you are saying to drop the seats below the chassis/floor level to gain a bit of headroom and effectively box around with a slope at the front for the sleeping policemen?

Sounds like you had a car like this??

I am going for a T top so will get a bit of room that way. Don't want to be looking through the top line of the spider though!!!! I'm 5' 11'' btw

yes, I’ve had at least 16 GT40’s in the past 20 years.
pm me with an email address and I’ll send some pics of the floors I put in my GTD.
Simon

KevinW
17-11-20, 10:07 PM
So do you get bored with them after a summer or 2, or do you have a fleet of them parked in different summer villas?????!

ChrisP
19-11-20, 05:26 PM
No pics to upload but I have been making progress of sorts. I have today ordered the complete MK1 body from Tornado. So I know what I am doing now! I have also spoken to the UN1 Transaxle expert and had a good look at the two gearboxes I have. Sounds like I can make at least one good one from the two, depending on what he finds when he dismantles them. And I am going to go for an LSD I think. It's another grand but hey, better than a load of bodywork or a new rear wheel after a spin!!
I need to get the panelling finished. It's tedious but I am getting there and my aluminium welding is improving slowly.
Soon I need to start thinking about the engine. It's a 68 302 in fairly standard trim. I am thinking I will go for a top end kit and get it up near 370hp or thereabouts. I am not intending to stroke it and hope to reuse the bottom end and pistons as they are, probably just with new shells but until I finish the strip I don't know. The one cap I have taken off revealed a new shell anyway!

jon1d
19-11-20, 07:11 PM
Nice seeing your making great progress. A stroked 302 to 347 will give you lots more. Nice to drop a set of Quad 48 IDA Weber carbs if its in budget but be careful with your cam selection. Going to a stroker you need different cam over lap profile. Better heads first off if they are standard and you will be banging 450 bhp !
To make it driverable on the road and not for the track your better off with a lower torque band. You don't want a screamer with all the power band around 4,000 rpm. Other wise it will be drinking fuel low tens !

ChrisP
19-11-20, 08:15 PM
Nice seeing your making great progress. A stroked 302 to 347 will give you lots more. Nice to drop a set of Quad 48 IDA Weber carbs if its in budget but be careful with your cam selection. Going to a stroker you need different cam over lap profile. Better heads first off if they are standard and you will be banging 450 bhp !
To make it driverable on the road and not for the track your better off with a lower torque band. You don't want a screamer with all the power band around 4,000 rpm. Other wise it will be drinking fuel low tens !
I think it’s going to be an Edlebrock top end kit only for now, topped off with a carb! I can always do more in the future. Much easier to get the engine out of a 40 than a cobra! I’m not sure another £3 or 4K is possible at the moment!!!!

ChrisP
21-11-20, 12:08 PM
Well I think it's an improvement! The ally panels are welded in to one piece. I've then polished out the welds and the sheets generally using polishing attachments on the grinder. Takes a bit of time but what else is there to do in lockdown. Same on the suspension components. I can also polish the back of the panels so the engine side looks as good. I am working on the off side front and rear corners now, then I'll start on the cockpit. I need to work out the best way to run all the pipes and wires back through the car. I can see that most run them up the centre but I might run them alongside the tanks in the sidepods and through the cockpit panels in the footwells. Having the water pipes in the sidepods might help with heat management in the cockpit. I am definitely going to insulate as best I can both for noise and heat.

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39081&stc=1

ChrisP
01-12-20, 07:05 PM
Although I haven't uploaded many pics I have been busy!!!

I popped out the pistons of the 302 (1968)

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39095&stc=1

Big ends are pretty good. The pistons and rings look pretty good too, although one was showing some signs of a bit of heat. They are plus 30 thou, so more options available on the block. Rods look good although I have not yet checked them for round. So onwards and the crank.......

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39096&stc=1

which also looks pretty good. Some slight signs of wear. Bearings all good but will replace anyway. It's plus 20 thou so plenty of scope. Whether it's straight or not remains to be seen!

Then the bores ......

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39097&stc=1

There are some scratches on a few of the bores in the lower section (below the rings). They are not bad and may hone out. Not sure what could have caused it as the bores have hardly had any wear since rebore. In fact, they have only just shone up and you can still see the newness where the skirts don't go. Could have been assembled with dirty fingers/workshop maybe?? I mentioned early in this thread that this motor had four bent pushrods and a bent valve (No 7 cylinder). No damage to the piston at all, not even a mark. Weird.
I also pulled the cam. Whether the cam was a bit wild and either the cam timing was a bit off or the piston/valve clearances were too tight, who knows. I can't ID the cam so will probably just bin it and put something in with known data I can work with.
The inlet manifold was a Weiand single plenum racing type (30 years old) that would suit a high revving engine, so could be the whole set up was on the wild side. Who knows.

I am taking the block et al to the machine shop tomorrow for some checks to see where we go. I was hoping to re-ring/shell and use the pistons and crank without spending out more but we will see!
If I need new pistons then maybe a 347 is on the cards after all!!!

ChrisP
01-12-20, 07:12 PM
Oh, and I have just about stripped the whole car now. I must nearly be getting to the point where the mess will come to a stop and it will start looking like I an getting somewhere!! I now have a scruffy looking chassis on the lift and a workshop full of what is mostly crap! Plus a trailer outside full of very sharp stainless sheet!
Even with the sun shining it doesn't look any better!!! Keep calm and carry on I guess..........
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39098&stc=1

Darnpistonbroke
02-12-20, 08:01 AM
Regarding your engine with bent push rods. Do you have hydraulic lifters? Just wondering if someone previously had gone into these without knowing what they are doing and reassembled them incorrectly. If that has happened then they could fill with oil but without the control thus hydraulic locking whilst full of oil. This will cause the designed gap to close too soon giving your pushrod nowhere to go, thus bending them.
I have had little experience with automotive hydraulic lifters as the ones I am used to are aircraft piston engine ones which can be dismantled and cleaned. Don't know if you can do that with automotive ones.

Also, word of advice. Despite what has been seen on TV is car SOS, Wheeler Dealers, etc, NEVER remove hydraulic tappets or valve spring retaining collets with a magnet. Very poor practice which can magnetise the items. If a hydraulic tappet becomes magnetised it can hold the little ball bearing off its seat causing the designed hydraulic lock to not occur and render the tappet useless. This will result in the cam shaft beating hell out of the cam follower and destroying the cam lobe.
Magnetised collets will attract iron filings and cause wear, where you don't want it which is possibly in the valve guides.

As you have probably guessed I'm pretty hot on magnets and engines, I avoid mixing the two like I try to avoid COVID!

Just a thought.

David.

aaronjb
02-12-20, 09:43 AM
Great progress Chris! Spring meet at your place once we've all had our Pfizer tracking chips implan.. I mean, vaccines? :)

David - collets I can figure out; pick them off the valve stem on a screwdriver with a blob of grease* (same way they go in) but how do you get lifters out of their bores without a magnet? Hm.. sucker on a stick, maybe?
(*Or in my case, fish them out of the head of the fiancee's MINI after they've fallen off before I could catch them, luckily none of them disappeared into the sump!)

Darnpistonbroke
02-12-20, 01:10 PM
Great progress Chris! Spring meet at your place once we've all had our Pfizer tracking chips implan.. I mean, vaccines? :)

David - collets I can figure out; pick them off the valve stem on a screwdriver with a blob of grease* (same way they go in) but how do you get lifters out of their bores without a magnet? Hm.. sucker on a stick, maybe?
(*Or in my case, fish them out of the head of the fiancee's MINI after they've fallen off before I could catch them, luckily none of them disappeared into the sump!)

In the bowl of the lifters where the pushrod sits, is there a small drilling to allow oil to escape? Certainly with Lycoming and Continental aircraft engines there are. I poke a small piece of wire into this with a right angled bend right at the end and hook them out.
If there isn't then I would suggest using something like the stick you lap valves in with. The stick with a couple of suckers on, one large one and one small one. That should create enough suction to grab the tappet and gently drag it out. It should work if there is no drilling in the dip. Or a blob of very thick and sticky grease. Fuel lube is good for this. Its a very thick, sticky grease used to lubricate fuel components where there is a risk of the fuel washing ordinary grease out.

David.

ChrisP
02-12-20, 06:06 PM
OK, been to have a chat with an engine building mate and then down to the machine shop. There is good news and bad news!!!!

7 of the 8 bores would clean up without a re-bore but darn it, that one bore means I need to go another 10 thou and am in to a set of pistons. So just looking at that, will probably go for some Keith Black 116 jobbies with the solid bump on them that will allow me to go for the bigger valved head with 2.02 inlet valves - the standard pistons (although a bit cheaper, will not work with the 2.02 and need a 1.90 valve). I should be able to get 10.5 to 1 compression with that set up.

We managed to identify the cam. Turns out it's what is now called an Edelbrock Performer! Just what I wanted. Except, darn it again, the previous builder had the end float all wrong (I think incompatible timing cog/cam/plate) allowing the cam to move about badly which has chipped some of the edges and messed the drive. That probably explains my bent valve (chip plus lift equalled contact)

So it looks like an Edelbrock top end kit after all. Big valve Performer RPM heads, Performer cam, Performer RPM Manifold which I hope with the KB pistons will get me near 367hp

New lifters and pushrods obviously. Also probably Eagle rods with 3/8 rod bolts as I understand the standard ones 5/16) at 360hp might be a bit vulnerable. Any comments?????

The crank looks good and hopefully will polish up. Fingers crossed on that one. And the block itself looked OK. I left that there for checking. Oh, and I need a new harmonic balancer! This is all getting a bit pricey.

Any guidance gratefully received. I have never built a small block before so I am guessing/reading/listening!!

String
02-12-20, 08:18 PM
Chris

Interesting build thread, enjoying following it.

Whilst you’ve got the lump in pieces, and if you have a die grinder and it hasn’t already being done, you could consider flowing the oil drain back holes and cleaning up any flashing on the block etc. Unlikely to enhance performance by much, but whilst you’re being thorough, why not...running a tap through all bolt holes (or the correct threaded bolt with a shallow channel cut along its length) will help clean those up too.

I’m far from expert, mine being a SBC besides, but the above tips were gleaned from reading many books and talking with a couple of local engine builders who are experts. HTH and keep up the good work. Cheers.

aaronjb
03-12-20, 09:57 AM
This is all getting a bit pricey.

Next thing you know you'll be £10k in and drammyboy will be telling you that you could have had a perfectly adequate RV8 for £300 ;)

Plan sounds good though - albeit expensive. The cheapest way I found to get the parts here was Jegs/Summit to a freight forwarder and then wait the six weeks or so for the slow boat.. but that was the FE, maybe the smallblocks are more readily supported this side of the pond by the likes of Real Steel et al?

ChrisP
03-12-20, 10:46 AM
You are not wrong Aaron. Not so bad though, a set of decent pistons is £258. It all adds up that’s the problem! I need the pistons to get the machining done otherwise I am in to a big delay. Then I need the front balancer and flywheel to get the bloody thing balanced........... Not that there is a rush, just that now I am in to it I want to get on.
Very definitely yes to a meet up here with the cars when weather and COVID has improved. Plenty of space for the cars. Would be fun. Could also do a run to Classic Car Hub or Caffeine and Machine very easily from here. It will be a while before the GT40 turns a wheel though (even if it had any!!)

Lloyd Barnes
06-12-20, 11:52 AM
Worth checking the valve springs, v the cam lift x rocker ratio If you have bent push rods but no piston damage it could be the valve springs binding. Too much lift for the available valve travel etc.

ChrisP
06-12-20, 01:21 PM
Worth checking the valve springs, v the cam lift x rocker ratio If you have bent push rods but no piston damage it could be the valve springs binding. Too much lift for the available valve travel etc.
Have junked the entire top end and bought a matched up set from cam upwards including big valve heads but have the high compression Keith Black pistons to allow the clearance (dish one side, dome the other). Will check clearances and machine the domes if necessary. They are solid apparently. Hopefully as it is all matched it should work out of the box. Valve springs should be right for the cam. Definitely need to make sure cam end float is right as it wasn’t in the previous build. I think that may have been a factor in the bent valve. A chip off the cam might have rolled under the lifter. Will never know, but it was all knackered!!

JamesB
14-12-20, 08:36 PM
Interesting build Chris, enjoying this and looking forward to seeing the results.

ChrisP
14-12-20, 09:29 PM
Interesting build Chris, enjoying this and looking forward to seeing the results.
Thanks, so am I!!!! It’s trying me a bit at the moment. Being a bespoke chassis I am a bit knackered trying to work things out to fit the body I’ve ordered (MK1 Tornado) but haven’t got! For example, getting things like the pedals and steering column to work with the Tornado dash. There is a small indentation in the dash with not a lot of tolerance so the column needs to be pretty accurate. I know I need to move the existing position but am coming to the conclusion that in order to avoid the risk of a lot of rework I might just have to wait until I get the panels and dash. At least I have the engine to build meanwhile!! Picked up a LOT of boxes last week. Christmas has come early!!!

JamesB
15-12-20, 03:20 PM
I think it best to wait until you have the body and panels, setting up a different pedal box and steering setup was difficult enough on the RAM while I had it all here! FWIW I put a tilton 600 series pedal box in and have a speed sensitive PAS with NO assistance over about 30, happy to discuss if it would help.

ChrisP
15-12-20, 05:15 PM
I think it best to wait until you have the body and panels, setting up a different pedal box and steering setup was difficult enough on the RAM while I had it all here! FWIW I put a tilton 600 series pedal box in and have a speed sensitive PAS with NO assistance over about 30, happy to discuss if it would help.
Yes, would be interested in the PAS system, thanks. Not sure what to do with that yet. I don't have PAS on my cobra and it is fine until you come to park! I manage though. The GT has a BMW power steering rack in it at the moment but I really do not want to be running a pump plus the pipes all the way the length of the car, so that needs to come out.

JamesB
15-12-20, 05:40 PM
Drop me a PM with a number and I will call you and explain what I have done with my PAS and why, I think it could be what you need. I have not gone down the usual corsa route for good reasons.

mylesdw
18-12-20, 10:38 PM
On those Project Binky videos they used an electric power steering pump from a Jag or some such. Had the reservoir built in and means you could mount it close to the rack.

ChrisP
19-12-20, 06:47 AM
On those Project Binky videos they used an electric power steering pump from a Jag or some such. Had the reservoir built in and means you could mount it close to the rack.
I wondered whether there might be something like that around. That would allow me to use the current rack and mounts (I admit, I hate waste of any sort!). Will look in to it, it's worth investigation

ChrisP
19-12-20, 11:49 AM
Myles

Found this on YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Htrz_Wn4SZ8 which is exactly what you suggested using a Volvo (it's actually Ford) electric pump which looks easy to wire and plumb in. I'll give it a go. Got to be worth a try. I have no real experience of playing with PS systems. My tin tops have it but my cobra doesn't (and is fine without it for me).
I have no idea how the BMW rack will perform with this pump or indeed without it as the pump is switchable. If the steering was OK with no assistance when driving, it is feasible I could switch the pump off and only use it for parking etc. Anyone know if that might work?

I also like the idea of being able to switch the PS on when pushing the car about in the workshop with no engine running. If I didn't have the PS rack though I wouldn't bother!

So now I have potential electric PS, electric water pump, electric vacuum for the brakes and two bloody great cooling fans! I can see a big alternator being necessary!!!

mylesdw
19-12-20, 06:53 PM
There is some sort of matching needed pressurewise between the pump and the rack but if you are planning to switch it on just for parking it may not matter. You could have some sort of speed sensor that just switched it on automatically below (say) 4mph. That would help the battery/alternator situation too.

I'm guessing the GT40 is quite light at the front so probably the rack with no power will be fine for normal driving.

mylesdw
20-12-20, 12:47 AM
About 12 minutes in:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hR1nU9IJsoM&t=989s

ChrisP
21-12-20, 05:44 PM
I've been diverted from the GT for a few days renovating furniture (apparently it's now called upcycling!!). Anyway, her indoors is very pleased with the 'upcycled' dining table, dresser and corner cupboard which is just as well as when she sees the credit card bill with nearly £4k of performance engine bits and another £3.5k on clutch, flywheel, starter, gearbox cogs, LSD, adapter plate etc etc I will need some goodwill!!!!!!
Been back in the workshop today cleaning up and painting engine bits. I am very pleased with how they have turned out. It was tempting to just buy new stuff, especially as I found the timing cover was held together with mastic! Two massive cracks but I managed to weld them up.
The rocker covers looked a right mess but I cleaned them up, sanded them flat and coated them up with matt black HT paint. Then ran a sanding disc gently over the top of the fins to expose the ally. (Did the same on the Cobra when I built the engine). Turned out pretty good and I am happy to use them.
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39129&stc=1
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39130&stc=1

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39131&stc=1
I'm not even using the water pump but I couldn't help tidying up while I was at it! I will probably sell it as I will go for a Davies Craig electric jobbie (fondly referred to as a 'Craig David' pump around here!)

ChrisP
21-12-20, 05:51 PM
As I mentioned, I am intending to go for a Davies Craig 150 litre electric pump with a digital controller. If anyone has experience of these or similar I would be interested in feedback. An EWP will help me in several ways. Reduced engine length will mean no pump protruding in to my cockpit space, plus flexibility on location will help. The digital control of water temp is also appealing, quite a clever piece of kit with options to pulse when cold, run without a thermostat and to run on after switch off.
I bought this lovely little cover plate that adapts the timing cover (takes the place of the water pump) to allow the EWP to link in.
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39132&stc=1

ChrisP
21-12-20, 06:06 PM
Pistons

I have bought a set of Keith Black Hi po 116 pistons which are now at the machine shop being measured and matched up for boring the block. Anyone used these? They are a coated piston, high silicon. They are a bit different to what I am used to (which is mainly forged racing type kit). The Keith Black pistons run at just 0.0025 piston to bore clearance which is pretty tight. The other odd one is that the top ring has to be gapped at 0.026 which is pretty big. The engine expert I've been talking to (he uses them all the time) told me that if I don't follow the instructions and gap them as normal I can expect the top of the piston to pull off!!! So for once, I shall follow instructions!!

Interesting if anyone has experience of these (or similar cast pistons). I am using them whatever! There are some horror stories on the net but I suspect that is because people have not followed instructions. As I said the engine expert uses them all the time without problems. They allow me to use the big valve heads and to get the high compression I am looking for (I am aiming for 10.5:1, might be a bit less) as they have a -2.6cc dome on them.

mylesdw
21-12-20, 07:29 PM
I think someone already mentioned it but worth mentioning again - if you may go for Webers eventually, it makes a big difference to the choice of cam. Future-proofing it's called these days!

ChrisP
21-12-20, 08:23 PM
I think someone already mentioned it but worth mentioning again - if you may go for Webers eventually, it makes a big difference to the choice of cam. Future-proofing it's called these days!

Webers are out for now l’m afraid! Just too much money. I have gone for an Edelbrock Performer cam. Will do for now. Probably Edelbrock carb, not sure exact details yet, maybe a 750.

KugaWestie
21-12-20, 09:18 PM
The rocker covers have come up lovely, nice job.

incey1966
22-12-20, 08:27 AM
I have an Edelbrock 1411 750 CFM Carb in the shed if it's any good to you.

ChrisP
22-12-20, 09:06 AM
I have an Edelbrock 1411 750 CFM Carb in the shed if it's any good to you.

Yes please. Will PM you

ChrisP
19-01-21, 03:33 PM
The engine is still at the machine shop! I was hoping to have started putting it together but we have had balancing issues. I have to use a Cosworth flywheel to get inside the UN1 transaxle which means I can't use the Ford flywheel which has a 28oz counterweight. So had to wait for the new flywheel to arrive and we have to add our own counterweight. Then had a further delay with the new shells for the crank. Frustrating but could be worse. The whole rotating assembly can now get balanced this week hopefully.
So onwards........
Have completely redone the steering, cut out the old bulkhead, put in a new bulkhead bearing and a new UJ to get on to the BMW power rack. Have also tidied up the pedals.
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39197&stc=1

I have made the pedal box and steering adjustable as i haven't got the dashboard yet - on the GT there is only a narrow position to get your steering out and I am pretty sure the existing location was about 40mm out. Anyway, this way I can adjust it accordingly I hope! My OCD won't let me have that column anywhere except central in the cutout!!

ChrisP
19-01-21, 03:42 PM
Have also fitted a remote power steering pump with integral reservoir. It's a Volvo part, made by Ford

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39198&stc=1

And a new MGB servo and master cylinder and put new seals in the Girling clutch master

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39199&stc=1

And a remote vacuum pump! Thought I would give this a go. Saves running a pipe all the way through the car (same with the PS) and I doubt I will have much vacuum at low revs from the motor anyway

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39200&stc=1

Nothing finally fixed yet but it does all go in! I've started doing the fluid pipework too which means I have had most of the above in and out at least twice. Getting there slowly though

aaronjb
19-01-21, 04:10 PM
Neat little electric vac pump - what's the current draw like? It seems increasingly common for modern cars to use some kind of vac pump - at least PSA & BMW, anyway - rather than rely on intake vacuum, though I've no idea why (usually camshaft driven on BMW & PSA engines, and leak oil all down one end of the block when the seals fail..)

ChrisP
19-01-21, 05:20 PM
They have a relay and vacuum switch so only run when vacuum is needed! I'm going to need a decent alternator as I am going to be running an electric water pump too. I was thinking of a high output one (100amps at tickover). I think I might need it with the fans, electric water pump, vacuum and power steering and that's without lights!
The PS pump cost me £40 so if it works will be well worth it.

aaronjb
19-01-21, 05:30 PM
Yeah that's a lot of power draw - I was planning for a 100A alternator on the Cobra and all I have is the heated windscreen (not often on, I'd imagine) and ePAS.. but I figured the ePAS is a 50A draw peak, on its own.

mylesdw
19-01-21, 07:53 PM
Neat little electric vac pump - what's the current draw like? It seems increasingly common for modern cars to use some kind of vac pump - at least PSA & BMW, anyway - rather than rely on intake vacuum, though I've no idea why (usually camshaft driven on BMW & PSA engines, and leak oil all down one end of the block when the seals fail..)

Fuel injected cars need little or no inlet vacuum, for efficiency and performance it is avoided so I guess a pump is needed.

Andy302
27-01-21, 05:04 PM
You will also find one on Hybrids, without engine vacuum you need another source.

RogerKnill
27-01-21, 06:45 PM
What car is the vacuum pump from? It looks like a good solution. I’ve got one from a Jaguar (don’t know which model) but it doesn’t include the vac switch.

have you tested it to see how quickly the vac switch activates and how quickly vacuum builds?

thanks

Roger

aaronjb
28-01-21, 05:49 PM
Fuel injected cars need little or no inlet vacuum, for efficiency and performance it is avoided so I guess a pump is needed.

I wonder at what point it "changed over" - idle musing :) My 2003 Toyota MR2 didn't have a vac pump but pulled vacuum from the intake (even though the engine was at the back and brakes at the front!) IIRC, as did my 1992 300ZX.. but my 2007 BMW & 2007 MINI both have cam-driven vac pumps. Anyway.. back to Chris' GT40! :)

ChrisP
28-01-21, 06:08 PM
What car is the vacuum pump from? It looks like a good solution. I’ve got one from a Jaguar (don’t know which model) but it doesn’t include the vac switch.

have you tested it to see how quickly the vac switch activates and how quickly vacuum builds?

thanks

Roger
EBay special! Car builder solutions does them too but quite a bit more money. Haven’t tested it yet, time will tell!!

Chris1
29-01-21, 09:24 AM
The late 90's Ford Transits used a vac pump that was
incorprated on the back end of the 70 amp alternator.
That was used for the diesel models .
I used one of these alternators on my RV8 but removed the vac pump
due to not being required in my case.
Chris.

ChrisP
29-01-21, 01:53 PM
The late 90's Ford Transits used a vac pump that was
incorprated on the back end of the 70 amp alternator.
That was used for the diesel models .
I used one of these alternators on my RV8 but removed the vac pump
due to not being required in my case.
Chris.
That’s interesting. Didn’t know that. Will report back on effectiveness of this little pump at some point

ChrisP
29-01-21, 03:42 PM
Just taken a call from the machine shop. My 302 is back from the balancer's and all is ready to go. Exciting! Also be good to get the mountain of boxes (heads, pistons, manifold etc etc) out of the workshop and bolted on to the motor!
Will post some pics soon. The gearbox is also ready and looks amazing, all cleaned up and refurbished.
Once I get all that together I can sit it in the car and try to figure out the engine and gearbox mountings. It previously had a BMW in it and the Ford is totally different. I am going to have to weld a couple of chassis members in (40 x 40 stainless box). Bought the material from NextDay Metals which I recommend for stainless and alloy, great company. It will be an in out operation a few times but that's how it is. I'm sure I can figure it eventally.

Now to get that engine built.........

ChrisP
04-02-21, 09:38 PM
OK, so I have made a start

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39228&stc=1

Got the cam, crank, No1 piston and timing cover on. Also gapped all the rings. I wanted to get the timing cover and new harmonic balancer on as the balancer has three sets of timing marks! Got to love the aftermarket. So was eager to get the new timing pointer on and calibrate No1 at TDC. It was actually straight forward enough. Got No1 at TDC and guess what, the pointer lined up exactly with the only set of timing marks on the rear of the balancer, leaving the two sets on the front side to confuse someone else in the future!

Crank thrust was good and camshaft end float good too. The latter was a concern as for whatever reason the previous cam had been wildly moving which buggered the cam, dizzy drive and I reckon caused the bent pushrods I found.

Next job is to get the other pistons in. I have to say I have been struggling with the bloody stupid spiral gudgeon pin retainers on the Keith Black pistons. Anyone got the knack? Total PITA. Am thinking I will stick circlips in instead (just like the old FE). Did everything as instructions but just found them incredibly tight to get in nice and snug, especially the second ones when you are pushing on the pin. Just don't like them! Maybe I should have stuck with the press in pins but I thought floaters would be better. Am using Eagle rods. Any helpful advice gratefully received!!

The other thing of interest is the KB pistons require a 26 thou gap on the top ring, 16 on the second. I have it on good authority if you don't follow instructions then the top of the piston will pull off! So for once, I have followed instructions!!

A couple of days off now but it should hopefully come together quite quickly next week. Will take some more pics. Got it on a proper stand now which wasn't possible first thing today due to a UNC bolt length issue!!

RussellGower
05-02-21, 08:52 AM
Mine where Mahle so not sure if we talking about the same sort of clip (you can just see it between the wrist pin and the tool in the 2nd image) or not, but when I build my 347 SBF I made this handle little tool, the screw is used to walk the spring clip into the groove
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39229&stc=1 http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39230&stc=1

Regards
Russell

kdavies3
05-02-21, 09:25 AM
Oh! yes those spiral clips are a right pain in the arse.
By the time you get to #8 you'll get the knack.
You need to stretch them a little bit before you try to fit them.
I was going to offer a loan of my engine stand but you already have one.
My own 302 has spiral clips.
The last one I built for someone else had press pins (got them fitted at a local engineering shop).
Trouble was he fitted two of them backwards initially so they had to be removed and refitted.

ChrisP
05-02-21, 09:35 AM
Thanks guys. Yes, stretched them out but still couldn’t get them in easily and the second ones impossible! I have ordered some circlips. Life is too short to worry about such things! To be honest, I was worried about damaging the piston, they were that tight. I might be thick but my engine building buddy couldn’t get them in either, so I’m wondering if I have a bad batch. Will try circlips next
Those mahle ones look a lot better and what a lovely tool!!!!

kdavies3
05-02-21, 09:39 AM
Are the piston grooves the same for both clips?
I would definitely check that!
I've seen what happens when a clip comes out and allows the pin to move sideways. (Jaguar V8 production engines).

ChrisP
05-02-21, 10:02 AM
Are the piston grooves the same for both clips?
I would definitely check that!
I've seen what happens when a clip comes out and allows the pin to move sideways. (Jaguar V8 production engines).

It looks like a clip will be ok. Obviously not designed for one but I think it will work. To be honest, I have zero confidence in those bloody spirals, especially after I have been twisting them about!!! My buddy (who builds hundreds of engines mainly Rover V8's) was very scathing of the spirals and I'm with him!! I have measured up and hopefully ordered the right clips from Bearing Boys. Will let you know and post a pic when happy!!!!

ChrisP
07-02-21, 12:14 PM
So who said those spiral locks were hard to put in???? I had another go after speaking to a mate who said it was easy (one mate told me he just uses his fingernails, well not with these!)! Watching the Summit video was really helpful https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NB2t3b29beE&t=282s and I recommend this to anyone BEFORE trying to do it.

Still a bit tricky with the 'triple spirals' that come with the KB pistons. Apparently a lot are 'only' double - that does sound easier. The change that allowed me to do it was the piston clamp. There is absolutely no way I would have got them in without one. The advice on the Summit video was to 'stay calm and take your time'. Good advice. I set the clamp up on Mrs P's kitchen island unit (bless her), good light behind me and a coffee by my side. I can see why people say it's easy to do them, as once you have cracked it, they aren't too bad but you need the right kit (good clamp and a small screwdriver) and most importantly you need to be in the right mood!!
Anyway, they are done!

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39236&stc=1

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39237&stc=1

Engine is now on stand and waiting for those pistons. Will crack on tomorrow.....................

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39238&stc=1

JamesB
08-02-21, 02:24 PM
Like the look of that engine, coming along nicely. Did you get the new body shell yet?

aaronjb
08-02-21, 02:57 PM
Tell you what, I think if I G-clamped bits of engine to the kitchen island, I'd be walking funny for a while.. once the docs had removed them from my rear, anyway :lol: (I jest, she's been putting up with a set of sidepipes living on the landing for a couple of years now!)

Is it just me, or is the outside of your engine painted go-faster-gold?

ChrisP
08-02-21, 04:21 PM
Like the look of that engine, coming along nicely. Did you get the new body shell yet?

Getting there now! The body is due next month

ChrisP
08-02-21, 04:23 PM
Tell you what, I think if I G-clamped bits of engine to the kitchen island, I'd be walking funny for a while.. once the docs had removed them from my rear, anyway :lol: (I jest, she's been putting up with a set of sidepipes living on the landing for a couple of years now!)

Is it just me, or is the outside of your engine painted go-faster-gold?

Years ago, I built the 427 in the kitchen (well it was cold outside). Heck of a thing to get out over the utility room threshold!!

Yes, definitely go faster gold!!! I have decided to paint the car black with gold accents so hence the gold motor.

ChrisP
08-02-21, 04:31 PM
Today's progress.............

Rods and pistons in (complete with spiral locks!!)

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39241&stc=1

heads on

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39242&stc=1

And lifters in, pushrods in and manifold on

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39243&stc=1

Should finish it tomorrow..................

ChrisP
08-02-21, 04:39 PM
Oh, and this is the new timing pointer with No1 on TDC, perfect!!!! I only need zero as I do the rest with the gun. The balancer is not pushed fully home btw. And ignore the odd bolts in pics above - new sets are on order

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39244&stc=1

aaronjb
08-02-21, 04:51 PM
You are moving on apace! You're either a lot more confident or competent than I am ;) :lol:

Engine looks great :)


Years ago, I built the 427 in the kitchen (well it was cold outside). Heck of a thing to get out over the utility room threshold!!

I bet! I am not looking forward to manhandling the 390 & Tremec out of the car (so I can get the 462 & Tremec back in again) .. and I only need to move the crane around a level floor. Though I have (re)discovered that the scissor lift really gets in the way of the crane legs, so I have to push the car out (off the lift - two man job), move the lift, pull the car back in again, jack it up and then take the engine out. Rinse, repeat, etc!


Yes, definitely go faster gold!!! I have decided to paint the car black with gold accents so hence the gold motor.

Ah, JPS colours! :) Should look nice on the GT40, and period, too.

KevinW
08-02-21, 05:21 PM
'Hmm, very nice' to quote Frank Spencer.
Nice work, and at pace - good stuff.

ChrisP
08-02-21, 09:09 PM
All good fun. I had a bit of a scare though. First head on, torquing up the bolts like you do and you’ve guessed it, last bolt, final pull and ‘bang’! I had chased all the threads, so I immediately thought the bolt had broken. Pulled the head to discover that there was a thread repair in that hole which I hadn’t noticed and it had given way. Luckily we had a repair kit handy and drilled it out and ended up putting a half inch FE bolt in that hole (302 standard is 7/16). Fortunately those Edelbrock heads are made to also fit 351’s which have bigger bolts so all was good!
A bit bloody scary though. I had thoughts of taking the whole thing apart again. These things are sent to try you as my dad used to say. I am hoping for less stress tomorrow!!

mylesdw
08-02-21, 11:14 PM
How would you know what torque to use for the 'odd' bolt?

ChrisP
09-02-21, 04:30 PM
How would you know what torque to use for the 'odd' bolt?

Well I am sure there are lots of technical answers to that one but here's mine (tongue firmly in cheek) -

You are at last chance saloon on your build, if that thread doesn't hold that's it. So you put the socket on and that long old torque wrench and you start pulling. It's the scariest thing you'll ever do!! Then you clinch the cheeks of your arse tight and pull harder. When you can feel the sh*t squeezing through in to your underpants that's tight enough!!!

I am definitely not tightening it any further or checking it until it needs to come off!!!!

ChrisP
09-02-21, 04:40 PM
So today's progress -

Rockers on and preload done on all the tappets. Sump pan on, engine mountings fitted and finally rocker covers on. So in other words, it's just about there for now....

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39246&stc=1

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39247&stc=1

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39248&stc=1

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39249&stc=1

And started making up a frame so I can sit it on the floor and fit the transmission/transaxle etc

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39250&stc=1

ChrisP
09-02-21, 04:47 PM
Oh, and guess what, there was another poor thread in one of the engine mounts which I chose to replace. A great advert for Time Sert - http://www.timesert.com/html/inchsert.html a really good system which has (hopefully) got me out of trouble.

Before anyone asks, I did chase all the threads in the block. What I didn't notice was the repair deep down on the corner of the deck. It wasn't helped by being the one where the head dowel goes! That's my excuse. It cleaned out fine and felt fine but it was not robust enough. Anyway, all is well that ends well...........

kdavies3
10-02-21, 11:07 AM
I've used "Timeserts" myself funnily enough on FE rocker studs which had pulled from Edelbrock heads.
Brilliant bits of kit.

ChrisP
12-02-21, 05:51 PM
Well I can say one thing for sure, I am missing my mates heated workshop where we built the engine earlier in the week!!! Mine is Baltic by comparison so progress has been a slowed a bit! Next time I build a workshop I am going to insulate it and put a heater in. His big old gas heater was noisy but warm. Better than quiet and bloody freezing. Just no fun.

So, all I have done really is trial fit the adaptor plate, starter and transaxle. It all bolted up really well. I haven't put the clutch in at this stage. I need to get all this hanging in the chassis now so I can start fabricating the engine mounts and the chassis rails for the 302.

The previous BMW engine was mounted much lower on the block so I am thinking I will need to put some new chassis rails in higher up to support the Ford mounts and make something for the mounts to sit on and bolt up to. That's what other 40's appear to have. It would also stiffen up the rear end. I have bought a length of 40mm stainless box section to do the job. Anyway, hopefully once I get it in the car it will become obvious!!

Here is the transaxle (all refurbished and fitted with LSD/ATB and extra leggy 5th gear)

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39263&stc=1

ChrisP
15-02-21, 01:59 PM
Engine sitting in chassis! Great excitement here! Pics later.
Now trying to work out how the heck I mount it and at what height!!!

ChrisP
15-02-21, 06:19 PM
Dropped the engine in to the chassis today (in between repairing burst pipes which was a right pain when the GT40 was calling and the workshop was so much warmer!) so I could have a think and work out how to mount the engine.

My number one principal was line up the driveshafts as straight as possible with the BMW hub carriers. Then all I need to sort is the height which is a compromise of having the driveshafts 'level' when the suspension is in it's normal place and having the engine as low as possible to keep the centre of gravity down in the chassis.

I decided to try to make the mounts adjustable so I have a bit of flexibility. I reckon I am at my lowest as it is and I can pack up to make the engine and box higher if I need to.

Still work in progress (oh yes, lot's of work yet!) but here are some pics

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39265&stc=1

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39266&stc=1

I made up the lifting bar so I could balance the engine either with or without the transmission bolted on. I just hate lifting engines on the manifold. I know lots of people do but I prefer to make up brackets and lift on the heads.

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39267&stc=1

Without altering the chassis, the driveshafts/gearbox is as low as it can go in the current position

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39268&stc=1

With the engine in roughly where it needs to be, all i need to do is weld in a new chassis member (40mm stainless box) between existing chassis parts at the right height to pick up the 302 engine mounts. These will be welded up and then bolted through the new piece of chassis. That way I can lift the engine up if I need to by simply packing with steel plates between the new chassis member and the bottom of the new mount in the picture. I might try 10mm first.

I will triangulate the new member too so it stiffens up the whole rear of the chassis.

Onwards! Got a trip to the hospital tomorrow, I hope that is not going to slow me up too much!!

When I get the mounts tacked up it's engine back out and weld everything up. Then fix the aluminium to the rear bulkhead and we can crack on........

KugaWestie
15-02-21, 06:52 PM
Good stuff Chris

ChrisP
16-02-21, 05:35 PM
Got the engine mounts pretty well done today. Welded the new members in to the chassis too. Just need to put the cross bracing in. Also got to tidy up the gearbox mounts and when I take the engine back out to weld the inside seams etc I need to alter an existing cross member so it clears the bottom of the gearbox - it's currently sitting on it. Not gone to badly today..

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39269&stc=1

Engine mount welded up and positioned. Just need to paint it now.

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39270&stc=1

There she is, supported at last in the chassis without the crane.

The next challenge is going to be how I can get an alternator on it without the bloody thing sticking in my back! It's really tight. I need to get a very short crank pully and somehow work a plan. It's going to be a challenge!

GDCobra
16-02-21, 06:33 PM
That looks like it's begging for a cross member between the upper shock or hub link mounts. Any plans?

ChrisP
16-02-21, 07:10 PM
That looks like it's begging for a cross member between the upper shock or hub link mounts. Any plans?
Well spotted! Yes, there is one, I took it off to get the engine in. It will go back when I am ready and together with the extra metal I have put in to carry the engine mounts will make it a good stiff chassis.

ChrisP
24-02-21, 04:53 PM
Well things are slowly moving forward! I have now sorted out all the bolts on the engine now the replacements have finally arrived. I have also sorted out the various plugs and fittings for the manifold in preparation for the plumbing!
Got the clutch in and plumbed it up. Why not, it should be possible to test drive this car without the body! It seems to work OK but have been without any happy helpers so not been able to check properly.
I have also mounted the gearbox properly having altered the chassis to clear the bottom of the bellhousing.
Here is the slave cylinder all bolted in and bled (7mm bolts wtf, who keeps those in their workshop!!! Me now!!
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39292&stc=1
Gearbox mounts
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39293&stc=1
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39294&stc=1

Flexible clutch pipe on to chassis - this pic also shows the new chassis rails and the dreaded bolt I had to take out of my FE bolt box having stripped the threads on the 7/16 302 block!
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39295&stc=1

JamesB
27-02-21, 05:09 PM
Nice job, looking very tidy.

ChrisP
05-03-21, 03:32 PM
So much work to do and I have been messing about fitting these lovely little billet rocker tops!!!! Smart though, courtesy of Summit Racing

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39320&stc=1

Taken a lot of hours to sort out the alternator bracket - clearly not finished, lots of tidying to do, but getting there! There is no room in these cars!!

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39321&stc=1

Special pulley, special water pump blanking plate, special swivel thermostat housing! All £ and all bloody necessary otherwise it is going to be rubbing me in the back!!! And I am still going to have to modify the chassis a bit to get enough clearance on the alternator. Not going to finish it until the belt comes (on order). Will know where I am exactly then.

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39322&stc=1

Onwards!

aaronjb
05-03-21, 04:08 PM
Stupid question - Chris, where did you order your alternator belt?

Once upon a time I'd go to the nearest motor factors and say "I need a belt X long please!" but these days your choices are places like Euro Car Parts who can't do anything without a reg or.. Halfords :lol:

I resorted to ordering one from Rock Auto with some other stuff..

ChrisP
05-03-21, 06:42 PM
Aaron, Bought the belt from BearingTech. Most of the bearing suppliers do belts, I also use BearingBoys as well.

Happy Jim
05-03-21, 08:48 PM
Medway belts did mine, but loads of suppliers out there

JamesB
10-04-21, 06:50 PM
How is it going, missing the updates

GDCobra
10-04-21, 07:34 PM
Stupid question - Chris, where did you order your alternator belt?

Once upon a time I'd go to the nearest motor factors and say "I need a belt X long please!" but these days your choices are places like Euro Car Parts who can't do anything without a reg or.. Halfords :lol:

I resorted to ordering one from Rock Auto with some other stuff..

Oh don’t get me started! Everything’s so complicated now, even buying oil which used to be a simple case of whichever name you prefer (or which one tastes best to you) and had the correct numbers on the can. Now you have to read through reams of specifications.

just bought a fan belt myself, same length as current, 1013mm but too short. Guess it must have a fuller profile sosits higher on the pulleys. What a PITA

ChrisP
10-04-21, 09:47 PM
How is it going, missing the updates
Sorry, have been doing bits and pieces but for some mad reason I agreed to help my son with a house renovation!! Those with kids will know how the word ‘help’ ends up meaning doing all the work!
Anyway, I will hopefully get the body next week so can crack on.
Will try to get some pics on next week showing what I have managed to do which includes gearbox linkage and firewall and some of the plumbing. Having the body will allow me to progress a lot of things I have been holding due to unknown clearance issues etc

JamesB
11-04-21, 03:00 PM
Yes, interested to see the bodywork when it arrives. Well at some point when I am over your neck of the woods I'd like to have a look at it if you were agreeable, the GT 40 is something I'd like to do at some point, obviously got enough on my plate at the moment though!

ChrisP
11-04-21, 04:00 PM
Yes, interested to see the bodywork when it arrives. Well at some point when I am over your neck of the woods I'd like to have a look at it if you were agreeable, the GT 40 is something I'd like to do at some point, obviously got enough on my plate at the moment though!
Call by anytime. I no longer work for a living so when not helping the kids (enough is enough!!) I am usually about, probably in the workshop!
I was thinking about having a cobra meet here if I could get enough interest. It’s a good spot, not far from both Caffeine and Machine and the Classic Car Hub, both worth a visit
Chris

Firestarter29
11-04-21, 04:29 PM
I’m sure there’d be a lot of interest Chris :)

ChrisP
11-04-21, 05:16 PM
OK, so here is the little bit of progress I have made!

Put the new dizzy in (I also primed the oil pump and got plenty of oil around the motor). I had to do a nifty bit of chassis adjustment to allow the bloody thing to turn for the timing! Everything in this car is so tight. Anyway, I think it turned out OK.
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39445&stc=1

I made a little bracket and got the throttle cable in - it has to thread its way through the sidepods to the pedal
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39446&stc=1

I bought this lovely air cleaner from Summit........
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39447&stc=1

Finished the alternator bracket and got the belt on....Again, nifty little chassis adjustment necessary!! Looks a good little alternator though, 60amp version of a Kubota digger!
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39448&stc=1

Got the gear linkage in - obviously being rear engined adds a little challenge. I used the old linkage and cut and re-welded it to suit my new configuration. The slot allows me to vary the movement required, the lower, the more leverage, the less the gearstick needs to move. It actually works really well, I was quite surprised! I might need to shorten the slotted piece a bit if I get any movement at the tail of the gearbox but that can be done if necessary.
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39449&stc=1

Continued in next post.....

ChrisP
11-04-21, 05:30 PM
Continued ....

Lots of rod and UJ's! All pinned and bolted.............but as I say, it works and I don't think looks too bad. I was going to buy some new fancy UJ's but hey, why waste time and money......
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39450&stc=1

And it has to weave its way across the car, missing the suspension components and in to the cockpit.....
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39451&stc=1

And finally to a gearstick! Bought the knob on ebay, Chinese but cheap! Had to make an adaptor and cut and weld that on to the linkage but for £12, it's OK. Reverse is far to the left and back. I was thinking I might need something to make sure reverse is 'locked out' but actually when I sit in the seat my leg is as good as a stop! I don't think I will accidentally grab reverse. Will have to see when I have it running. Fifth is in the usual place, that is virtually against the sidepod. Anyway, they all go in, time will tell...
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39452&stc=1

Next, I started the firewall. Like I said, it's all so tight. I have double skinned it, got foil backed heatshield and fire retardant insulation 25mm thick, except where the alternator is, just not room for the 25mm. I still have to have a 'bump' for the top hose. I need to skin and insulate this as best I can. At least it's on the wife's side!! As are the pipes which will run down the left sidepod which is also well insulated. I have actually panelled the side pods just forgot to take a pic!
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39453&stc=1

And a final pic to show the plumbing started. I could have finished the pipework but thought I would wait for the body just in case of any clashes!!
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39454&stc=1

ChrisP
12-04-21, 08:17 AM
Thought I should clarify, just in case anyone is wondering why I am messing about cutting little clearance 'scoops' in the chassis instead of just moving the engine back! It's all in the interest of keeping the driveshafts straight. I could move the engine back easily. In an earlier pic I showed the mounts I made that will allow me to slide it back and adjust the height. I figured engine as far forward as possible and straight driveshafts was as good as it could be. So that's why I have done it!
The body is available to pick up Friday. Exciting. If it turns out the suspension needs moving in order to centre the wheels in the arch I shall be a little disappointed!!!! I am told the MK1 body arches align with the MK3................. I guess I will know in a week!

GDCobra
12-04-21, 12:34 PM
Thought I should clarify, just in case anyone is wondering why I am messing about cutting little clearance 'scoops' in the chassis instead of just moving the engine back! It's all in the interest of keeping the driveshafts straight. I could move the engine back easily. In an earlier pic I showed the mounts I made that will allow me to slide it back and adjust the height. I figured engine as far forward as possible and straight driveshafts was as good as it could be. So that's why I have done it!
The body is available to pick up Friday. Exciting. If it turns out the suspension needs moving in order to centre the wheels in the arch I shall be a little disappointed!!!! I am told the MK1 body arches align with the MK3................. I guess I will know in a week!

That's understandable but I think I'd have ditched the dizzy and replaced with a wasted spark or CoP system before I hacked the chassis around.
Mind you I've have ditched teh dizzy before I even thought about putting the engine in the car! Hate those things.

Each to their own though. I'm in no possition to tell anyone else how to build their cars.

TonyD
12-04-21, 02:32 PM
From my very limited experience of GT40 kits, as in one that belonged to a neighbour years ago, is that they are an absolute buggar to keep cool and the long pipe runs are brilliant in creating airlocks. Whilst the body is off I'd look at getting accessible bleed points at multiple locations across the cooling circuit ( remote if necessary ) and then vacuum fill when ready for good measure. Perhaps an auxiliary electric water pump in addition might not go amiss. Poor sod I knew could only drive the car to and from the mot each year as any further and the engine would overheat.

ChrisP
12-04-21, 04:15 PM
That's understandable but I think I'd have ditched the dizzy and replaced with a wasted spark or CoP system before I hacked the chassis around.
Mind you I've have ditched teh dizzy before I even thought about putting the engine in the car! Hate those things.

Each to their own though. I'm in no possition to tell anyone else how to build their cars.

I could have but you and I are opposites. I would much rather have a dizzy! Anyway, metal bashing is easy for me, Dad was a blacksmith so I learnt that very early! He was also a rodder. Funny really, he passed it to me and now my son is building cars too.

ChrisP
12-04-21, 04:24 PM
From my very limited experience of GT40 kits, as in one that belonged to a neighbour years ago, is that they are an absolute buggar to keep cool and the long pipe runs are brilliant in creating airlocks. Whilst the body is off I'd look at getting accessible bleed points at multiple locations across the cooling circuit ( remote if necessary ) and then vacuum fill when ready for good measure. Perhaps an auxiliary electric water pump in addition might not go amiss. Poor sod I knew could only drive the car to and from the mot each year as any further and the engine would overheat.

I think you are right! I have drilled and tapped the Performer manifold at the rear for two bleeds to a header tank. A guy who built a car last year tipped me off as his was boiling too due to air locks. You can't get the engine on much of a rake so air locks are a problem at the rear. Same issue with the carb, I have had to buy a wedge to get that to sit right.
I have ditched the mechanical water pump in favour of a Davies Craig 150 litre electric pump. Others have told me this will keep it cool. Time will tell! Good bit of kit with a digital controller which means I don't need a thermostat so that's one flow restriction out of the way. However, there is no way of piping from the front to the back without a good number of bends which all hinders the flow. They got the thing to win at Le Mans so it must be possible to cool it - maybe I need to drive it flat out!!

TonyD
12-04-21, 05:24 PM
I've used a Davies Craig pump before and they are good. If you could put an air bleed from the top of the radiator to the header tank, a long way but a small bore rubber pipe would work, that should cover all eventualities. No where for that pesky air to hide then.

ChrisP
12-04-21, 06:11 PM
I've used a Davies Craig pump before and they are good. If you could put an air bleed from the top of the radiator to the header tank, a long way but a small bore rubber pipe would work, that should cover all eventualities. No where for that pesky air to hide then.

Thanks for that. Yes, I have a take off on the rad for just that purpose. Another long run! Should go down the side pod.

TonyD
12-04-21, 07:00 PM
Thanks for that. Yes, I have a take off on the rad for just that purpose. Another long run! Should go down the side pod.


Seems like you've got it all in hand. :D

ChrisP
12-04-21, 07:14 PM
Seems like you've got it all in hand. :D

I doubt that! It will be interesting to see how it runs. I’m a fair way off that at the moment. Will get there though!

simon
13-04-21, 07:27 AM
Chris, I’ve had several GT40 replicas (18+ now.....Almost lost count)
a few points (based on experience)
Electric water pump (not essential but helps keep temps down particularly after stopping the car, leave the EWP running for 5 mins to re-distribute the heat)
throttle cable, make sure it is heat shielded around the engine or the type that trucks use near turbochargers......trust me, a sticking throttle cable is NO FUN!
clutch line, 3/8 rather than 5/16, MUCH better clutch control, less issues.
low/short dizzys are available for Fords

have you dropped the engine from the standard position? Depending on the sump, it’s possible to drop ENG/box by up to 1-1.5 inches.....gives a tad more room.

simon

ChrisP
13-04-21, 02:57 PM
Chris, I’ve had several GT40 replicas (18+ now.....Almost lost count)
a few points (based on experience)
Electric water pump (not essential but helps keep temps down particularly after stopping the car, leave the EWP running for 5 mins to re-distribute the heat)
throttle cable, make sure it is heat shielded around the engine or the type that trucks use near turbochargers......trust me, a sticking throttle cable is NO FUN!
clutch line, 3/8 rather than 5/16, MUCH better clutch control, less issues.
low/short dizzys are available for Fords

have you dropped the engine from the standard position? Depending on the sump, it’s possible to drop ENG/box by up to 1-1.5 inches.....gives a tad more room.

simon

Good tip on the throttle cable - I had not thought of that. I could drop the engine lower, I have clearance on the sump but I am at the lowest I can go without the driveshafts fouling the chassis I think. It might mean a rake in the wrong direction - i.e. gearbox higher than engine. Will have another look at it

mylesdw
13-04-21, 09:16 PM
I can recommmend Felsted Cables for high quality stuff. I believe they used to supply the F1 teams.

3/8" clutch line is massive; I've never heard of one greater than 1/4" and I can't see why it would make any difference to clutch control?

ChrisP
17-04-21, 11:29 AM
Got the body! Here we go!!!! Just had a quick look and the fit looks good. I know where I am now, I can hopefully crack on (although the cobra is calling today with the sunshine out)

Dashboard fits in and thankfully my new steering column will line up with the moulded position......

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39460&stc=1

The central body will sit down once I have cut the hole for the wiper motor - just goes to show how close the different manufacturers are with the mold..

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39461&stc=1

The rear (MK1) shell is in much better fettle than the original (MK3)

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39462&stc=1

Doors with T Tops

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39463&stc=1

T Top retainers - to be honest I can't see me ever putting the tops in, running 'open' appeals to me. Time will tell

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39464&stc=1

And the front - went for the twin vents although a single is available

ChrisP
17-04-21, 11:30 AM
And the front - went for the twin vents although a single is available

Sorry - here is the front

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39465&stc=1

KugaWestie
17-04-21, 03:31 PM
Very nice. I expect that releases lots of work for you now you have some reference points

ChrisP
17-04-21, 04:31 PM
Very nice. I expect that releases lots of work for you now you have some reference points

Exactly, now I know where I am I can fit things properly. I have been hanging back worried that if I fitted things it might mean rework when the body arrived. I am amazed the dash fits so well. Underneath there is a mess of really bad welds and some pretty ropey metalwork that supported the MK3 dash and the top of the steering column. I have some new s/s 25mm box, now I know where I am I can cut the rubbish out and replace it with the new stuff. The doors are going to be a challenge I think, but we will see. Hopefully I can fettle something that will work with the Tornado hinges I have bought. I can also paint and fit the aluminium inner wings I have made.
Very impressed with the Tornado body. Looks really good. Andy Sheldon (Tornado owner) has a brand new aluminium bodied cobra with a side oiler in it! Really nice. Had a good look at that with him too. Dave Brookes built it.
Lots to do! Just need to get my son's house finished first! Now Daughter has bought a new one too! Ah well, there's always next winter!!!!!

Bannon
17-04-21, 04:38 PM
Those mouldings are beautiful. This car fell into the right hands. Love it.

ChrisP
18-04-21, 05:34 PM
Have dropped the central section, the dash and the front on today. I had to alter the chassis to get the front on. It was too wide where the Tornado headlight moulding is, just by about 15mm each side. I deliberated whether to hack the body or 'slim' the chassis and in the end opted for the latter. Still work in progress but I have it under control I think!

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39471&stc=1

I also had to hack some of the rough metalwork out of the dash area in order to get the dash to sit right. Again, I know where I am now and can weld some new strength in there and pick up the steering column etc

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39472&stc=1

But, it's all getting there! I'm glad I hadn't fitted the panels I made as this body is a slightly different shape and I can now make a better job of it by altering the chassis to fit the body. That way it will close all the gaps, improve sound and water proofing and also give the body better support. I am aiming to get all the panels roughly in place and then take stock and modify as required.

Although I am keen to crack on I also want to enjoy my cobra and I have 16 hives of bees that require attention this time of year!! Plus I've got the front of my son's house to put back up! Never a dull moment. The '40 is calling though.................really enjoying it

ChrisP
01-05-21, 04:49 PM
I managed to get a few hours in the workshop today. I have tackled the problem of the front clip not sitting down properly. I could see the chassis just hanging below the front (air intake) and also felt the body was not quite sitting right. Having had a chat with Andy Sheldon at Tornado he told me that the rear of the clip (where it abuts the door) should be absolutely upright. It wasn't. It looked like the front needed to go down about 25mm and that meant cutting the chassis as it was sitting tight as it was. I also had to 'sculpt' for the headlight units. These were just hitting my existing chassis.
Before I got the grinder out I added a couple of braces so that nothing could move. Not that I was too worried as all the very front is doing is holding the radiator and the clip/bonnet.
First I cut 25mm out of the front uprights - you can see the braces I added too


http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39492&stc=1

This image shows the 'sculps' for the headlight moulding and the cut to allow the front to drop. Again the brace is holding everything in place
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39493&stc=1

Then I welded it all up and smoothed off the welds and added some strengthening to the back of the 'sculpted' areas
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39494&stc=1

Job done!
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39495&stc=1

Dropped the clip back on and it sits perfectly now, the air scoop covers the chassis at the front and the door jamb is perfectly upright. I have ordered some rubber bumps to help support the body. Now need to try to work out the hinging. But first I am going to try the rear and see how that sits down. It's all very tight back there. I am worried I might need to lower the engine which will be a bit of a pain but at least I have made the mounts fairly easy to adjust (I hope!!)

kdavies3
02-05-21, 10:51 AM
Fabulous work Chris. :p

JamesB
03-05-21, 02:01 PM
I like it, that's going to look fabulous. The fibreglass sections look really good quality. What's the plan for the externals? I like the less is more look, as little bling as possible as close to a "factory" original race car as you can. But its your car of course, just don't do it wrong...........

ChrisP
03-05-21, 03:41 PM
I like it, that's going to look fabulous. The fibreglass sections look really good quality. What's the plan for the externals? I like the less is more look, as little bling as possible as close to a "factory" original race car as you can. But its your car of course, just don't do it wrong...........������

Well the plan is for a JPS themed livery. No chrome as such, but decals in the spirit of the Lotus Cosworth of 1972. Nothing really to do with GT40's but of the period and 'different'. So many Gulf cars and Le Mans cars out there. I like to be a bit different. Hence my Cobra is as it is. Very much in the spirit of a Cobra but not a 'true replica' by any stretch, even though it has a period correct 427 engine. I always liked the JPS livery as a kid. So that's where I am heading at the moment. All that matters is that I and Mrs P like it!!!!
I am not planning to sell it, so it really doesn't make any difference if others hate it!!

JamesB
03-05-21, 07:33 PM
No, i can see that looking really good. As you say its you that needs to love it but that sounds interesting. I always loved the JPS livery, nearly bought a JPS Europa twin cam about 30 years ago, wish I had.........

ChrisP
04-05-21, 03:53 PM
Bugger! Tried the rear clip this afternoon and as I suspected the chassis is too long! The MK3 body is obviously a big longer. So I needed to cut off the rear end. I will have to work out a way to get it braced back together. I also have an issue with my gearchange support, that needs shortening too.....

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39497&stc=1

Need to cut off the rear horizontal member and the diagonal pieces

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39498&stc=1

And now the chassis looks like this!!!!

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39499&stc=1

But the body at least now sits on there. I now have to figure out what to do with it. I need to work out the hinging mechanism too and provide chassis support for those

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39500&stc=1

Now it's on there I can see the engine is indeed a bit high. I did think it might be. Once I have the body sorted and sitting right with the rear chassis repaired I need to look at the engine. Nobody said it would be easy!!!!!!

KevinW
04-05-21, 04:25 PM
Good work.
I would have been tempted to insert a fillet in the grp to lengthen it, and left the mechanicals as-is, or perhaps I misunderstood?

ChrisP
04-05-21, 05:10 PM
Good work.
I would have been tempted to insert a fillet in the grp to lengthen it, and left the mechanicals as-is, or perhaps I misunderstood?

A fillet would have worked but I am happy with an angle grinder in my hand!! It keeps the body as it should be. Only took 5 minutes to cut it out, I am hoping an hour to get it back!!!!

jon1d
04-05-21, 05:45 PM
Your making great progress. Great to see the body arrive. Must of felt like Christmas.

Your rear gearbox mount look quite sturdy. I know there is a lot of movement and seen supports fracture on a road trip in Europe. Some movement on the mounts is necessary.

I think its the twist and mount positions acts like a pivot point putting a lot of strain through the rear fixing points.

ChrisP
04-05-21, 06:01 PM
Your making great progress. Great to see the body arrive. Must of felt like Christmas.

Your rear gearbox mount look quite sturdy. I know there is a lot of movement and seen supports fracture on a road trip in Europe. Some movement on the mounts is necessary.

I think its the twist and mount positions acts like a pivot point putting a lot of strain through the rear fixing points.

Could be. They have a rubber bush inside with a stainless sleeve, you probably know the sort. Do you think that's too much/too stiff?

jon1d
04-05-21, 08:11 PM
The ones I saw where solid mounts so no flexibility so yours might be ok . Worth seeing how you get on with your gear linkages.

JamesB
04-05-21, 08:35 PM
I imagine that's entirely appropriate, if its rubber then it will have a lot more give than a poly bush for example and they are adequate for such a purpose.

ChrisP
13-05-21, 02:01 PM
Oh dear! Well that's the polite way of saying it!! I am now starting to understand the relationship between my new Tornado Sports Cars body and the chassis I have. The front end I have pretty much dealt with, the rear however is another matter! I showed a few pics of me shortening the rear end in order to accommodate the Mk1 body. I have now worked out a plan to rebuild that part and provide structure for the hinging of the rear section. However, there is a much bigger issue. Talking to Andy at Tornado I should be getting my engine down another 40mm, i.e. so the bottom of the oil pan sits in the same plane as the bottom of the car. If I do that, then I stand a chance of getting the standard Tornado exhausts out of the appropriate holes in the body. The other option is to leave it 'high' and bespoke make some pipes to get me out, that is if I can get enough space between the engine and the body!! I also have an issue with the air cleaner which is currently sticking through the rear window!! So down would be better.
It's a bit of a minefield.
I have had a good look at the chassis construction today. To lower the engine that much then I need to cut out the rear around the suspension mounts and put new chassis structure in place 40mm lower. Otherwise my driveshafts will not clear the chassis. I also have a cross member that will foul the gearbox. It's fairly major work. My first thought was to leave it as it is and get around the issues but thinking about it I am minded to cut it all out and do the job properly. Better to have a lower centre of gravity. Much cheaper to use the Tornado exhausts and I know they will fit below the body if the engine is where theirs is as will the air cleaner.
I think I can stabilise it all by welding in some new structure before I do any cutting and not let any of the suspension points move. I would then cut all the offending metal out and put in the full new structure. I would also have to drop my (new!) engine and gearbox mounts and the gearbox linkage. A lot of work but would get it 'right'!
Still looking and thinking. No rush. The cobra is calling and the weather has to improve! Life goes on. Anyway, it's only time, cutting discs and welding wire!!!!

Bannon
13-05-21, 08:38 PM
Blimey - how the plots always thicken, eh? I think the extra work for the 40mm drop sounds well worth the time and effort. Anything else would be a compromise. Sounds amazing though, and so worth it. Love the updates!

JamesB
14-05-21, 10:28 AM
I think you will have to do it. If you don't you will be unhappy with the compromises and will regret it even subconsciously. If you cut it all out and lower it all you know that its right and ultimately you will have more enjoyment out of that in the end even if it causes some grief in the short term.

ChrisP
14-05-21, 01:19 PM
I think you guys are right, I have to do it!!!!

Here is the problem. I set my engine height at the lowest possible to get the driveshafts out above the chassis rail. You can see, I only have 10mm or so. That was my mistake! I am going to have to cut the chassis and drop it. Unfortunately it is at the point where the wishbone mount is welded on the outside.

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39531&stc=1

And on the inside is the crossmember under the gearbox, so this will have to go too............

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39532&stc=1

And in this shot you can see end on the offending rail that effectively needs to be dropped to the lower level rather than the 'ramped up' position it currently has.

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39533&stc=1

All bit of a pain but has to be done! I just need to get myself in the mood. Have been fiddling with the cobra this morning instead!

JamesB
14-05-21, 03:30 PM
That's a pain but it could be worse at least you are able to drop it in line with the rest rather than having to drop it below other extant framework. No, as much as its a pain I really think you have to do it.

ChrisP
14-05-21, 05:51 PM
That's a pain but it could be worse at least you are able to drop it in line with the rest rather than having to drop it below other extant framework. No, as much as its a pain I really think you have to do it.
Yep, will do it! Need to get in the right frame of mind and will get that angle grinder going again!!!!! I suspect it's one of those jobs that once I set to it will go fairly quickly.

ChrisP
15-05-21, 05:10 PM
The cutting out has commenced! Thank god for angle grinders and plasma cutters!
Will see how it goes and will post some pics when appropriate.
BTW, I have a spare 40 amp plasma cutter if anyone wants one. Only a cheap Chinese thing but it works. Free to a good car building home. (I haven’t used it since I bought my RTech one)

Bannon
15-05-21, 07:10 PM
Yeah!!! Chop Suey!!! Interested to know how you have secured the position of the wishbone mount - I guess you've jigged it into position prior to removing the beam?

JamesB
15-05-21, 07:26 PM
I could do with the cutter Chris unless you have any other takers

Will be your way next month but not until then

ChrisP
15-05-21, 07:46 PM
You’re welcome to it. No problem, it’s been sitting under my bench for a while so a bit longer won’t matter! I have a load of spare tips for it too.

ChrisP
15-05-21, 07:49 PM
Yeah!!! Chop Suey!!! Interested to know how you have secured the position of the wishbone mount - I guess you've jigged it into position prior to removing the beam?

Progressive cutting and welding in new. Nothing has moved yet! Will post some pics tomorrow or soon.
I think it will all work out ok. Have tried to get a plan in my head!

JamesB
15-05-21, 08:02 PM
Thanks, appreciated, I will talk to you nearer the time I come down, I think about the 12th June from memory.

ChrisP
16-05-21, 04:22 PM
One side is done! Here are some pics

Cross members cut out to allow the gearbox to drop. I have put a new one in just in front of the flywheel/adapter plate
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39538&stc=1

I then made up a new member to brace behind the wishbone mount and to take the wishbone mounting load. You can see I have run the plasma cutter through the plate that holds the wishbone mount but only on the back. I cut it because access would be tricky after the new member was welded in
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39539&stc=1
Note the little 'sculpt' to allow the bellhousing to drop in to the space

When the lower member was welded in I cut out the outer face with the plasma cutter

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39541&stc=1
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39540&stc=1

Plenty of room to drop the gearbox 40mm

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39542&stc=1

continued in next post.......

ChrisP
16-05-21, 04:30 PM
continued from last post.............

A bit of stainless bent in place to tidy it up
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39543&stc=1

And welded in
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39544&stc=1

All in - i'll tidy up the top when I take the engine out and have more space
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39545&stc=1
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39546&stc=1

Still got some tidying to do but some progress at least! Just need to do the same on the other side now!!!
Probably should have worn gauntlets! There are that many little burns on my arms I look like a heroin addict! Welding underneath and upside down is not without challenges!!
Onwards..................

Bannon
16-05-21, 05:58 PM
Fantastic work! Totally the right thing to do, I bet you can feel that already. Nothing worse than wishing you'd done something a different way when it's too late to change it. Great job.
I'll update my hardtop thread later - been doing a bit myself...

Grumbleweed
16-05-21, 07:32 PM
Great work, definitely the correct thing to do. Really looking forward to following this thread and seeing the progress.

ChrisP
16-05-21, 07:36 PM
Great work, definitely the correct thing to do. Really looking forward to following this thread and seeing the progress.

Thanks both. I hope to have more progress than snags at some point!!!! Will get there (eventually!)

JamesB
16-05-21, 11:54 PM
Yes, the right solution and it did not take long in the grand scheme of things.

kdavies3
17-05-21, 11:26 AM
Good work Sir!
My hat is off to you.

ChrisP
17-05-21, 12:17 PM
Good work Sir!
My hat is off to you.

Thanks Kev
I don't think either of us foresaw what was to come with this chassis!!! Despite the hassle, I am enjoying it. I just hope it handles OK when it's all done!!!!
Hope you get yours sorted soon - sounds like that's been a real pain

ChrisP
21-05-21, 12:02 PM
After a few days away from the 40 ( I even managed a trip in the cobra to a car meet on Wednesday - which meant I spent half the day yesterday cleaning the car after driving on sodden roads) I have started the other side of the chassis and hope to get that done today or tomorrow. It's going fine, much easier having done the other side. Will then have a look at the engine mounts and see if I can get it down to the level.
If anyone is interested, I am welding the stainless with an R-Tech Mig using the Spool Gun function and pure Argon. I have a 0.7kg spool of 1mm stainless in the gun. There are two advantages of using the spool gun, first it has a 4m reach on the cable whereas most standard mig cables are a lot shorter meaning you need to move the welder to get around the car. Second, I can buy small spools of brass, aluminium or stainless and leave the steel wire in the mig welder. I find the spool gun really good, the wire is right there so when welding ally there is little chance of bunching or catching.
I am also using an R-Tech Plasma Cutter. Sounds like I am sponsored by R-Tech but I'm not! I just find their kit really good. My mates (one of which builds race cars) also use their stuff.
Right, coffee is gone, back to it............................

jon1d
21-05-21, 01:07 PM
ChrisP,

I know the R-Tech welders are great. I was looking at TIG but looking at the R-Tech Mig and spool gun it does look good. The interesting part i it does aluminium as well as stainless. Some good videos on there site showing aluminium. I was surprised how clean a weld you can achieve with the spool gun on aluminium.

I guess your welding 304 SS ? Are these the spools your using 308lsi ?

https://www.r-techwelding.co.uk/sifmig-308lsi-1mm-0-7kg-stainless-sif-wo331007/

ChrisP
21-05-21, 01:52 PM
ChrisP,

I know the R-Tech welders are great. I was looking at TIG but looking at the R-Tech Mig and spool gun it does look good. The interesting part i it does aluminium as well as stainless. Some good videos on there site showing aluminium. I was surprised how clean a weld you can achieve with the spool gun on aluminium.

I guess your welding 304 SS ? Are these the spools your using 308lsi ?

https://www.r-techwelding.co.uk/sifmig-308lsi-1mm-0-7kg-stainless-sif-wo331007/

Yes, using 308 spool. And don't forget you can use brass and braze with them too. Very flexible. I have an R-Tech TIG. I should sell it really. I hardly use it, the Mig is so much easier and quicker and yes, you can get some decent welds on ally with practice (as good as my tigging but that's not saying a lot!!). A lot more skill with TIG, and probably a lot more practice too. For whatever reason, I have struggled with the TIG hence I use the spool gun. If I had had the spool gun before the TIG I wouldn't have bothered buying it.

R-Tech are fairly local to me too so makes it even better.

aaronjb
21-05-21, 02:16 PM
R-Tech are fairly local to me too so makes it even better.

Great support, too. The only product of theirs I've been disappointed with (I've got their AC/DC TIG170 - wish I'd bought the 210 but hey ho - and a mate has their MIG set) is the XXL auto-darkening mask.. it's working alright with replacement guts, though, so I can't fault it too much (and they supplied replacement guts at 11 months old without question)

Eventually I'll replace the old Clarke MIG set I have with one of theirs .. eventually.

RogerKnill
21-05-21, 06:34 PM
Great support, too. The only product of theirs I've been disappointed with (I've got their AC/DC TIG170 - wish I'd bought the 210 but hey ho - and a mate has their MIG set) is the XXL auto-darkening mask.. it's working alright with replacement guts, though, so I can't fault it too much (and they supplied replacement guts at 11 months old without question)

Eventually I'll replace the old Clarke MIG set I have with one of theirs .. eventually.

what was the issue with the welding mask?

was thinking of getting one as I’m not happy with my ebay special

ChrisP
22-05-21, 05:03 PM
OK, have finished both sides of the chassis alterations around the driveshafts and taken the engine back out today. Having looked at my options, I decided to cut out the chassis rails I added in for the engine mounts and lower the whole lot 40mm. That avoids any tight spots around the starter and also allows me to use the standard oil filter housing on the block rather than a remote one (just a matter of space).

I have cut out one side and got it ready to go back in. I also took the opportunity to cut out the old BMW engine mounts out too.

Should get it back in tomorrow and hopefully get the other side done. Would be nice to get the engine back in too but will see how it goes.

Will post some pics when I have it done.

ChrisP
23-05-21, 06:02 PM
Sorted, chassis all altered and engine back in. Lots of cutting and welding but it's done and I'm pleased with the result. The sump of the 302 is now down at floor level and the gearbox driveshafts just clear above the 'lowered' chassis. I need to sort the gearbox mounts and gear linkage now but here are some pics of the revised chassis

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39551&stc=1

And lowering the entire 'rail' allowed me clearance to keep the standard oil filter mounting

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39552&stc=1

I can now crack on hopefully (until I find the next snag!!!)

KugaWestie
23-05-21, 06:29 PM
Excellent work Chris, onwards and upwards now

ChrisP
28-05-21, 10:32 AM
So now I have the engine sitting down as low as possible (it really is now as the sump plug is at floor level and that is low on a GT40!) I can think about standard exhausts from Tornado. At the Spetchley Meet on Wednesday (650 cars, amazing, so nice to get out and be 'normal') I was lent a set of GT40 exhausts by Tornado to try on my car. Believe it or not, I managed to get the lot, silencers and all, in the boot of the cobra! I have stuck them on for a trial fit. All is looking good. Just need a willing helper to lift the body on but from what I have seen from earlier trial fits it should work nicely. Here are some pics

A tangle of snakes or what!
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39580&stc=1

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39581&stc=1

Now I will know if I can order a standard set of exhausts from Tornado which will be much cheaper and easier than bespoking a set. Finished in ceramic, coloured gold is the plan to go with the JPS theme.

Just need to work out how to hinge the body now. My chassis is so different from the Tornado one but it must be possible with some steel and some welding!!!!!

Also at the Spetchley meet was a lovely completed Tornado GT40 to inspire me! Useful to have a good look at it too but as I said, so different to mine. The owner, Mark, is going to come up to mine in the car so we can kick the tyres and compare things. He has done a cracking job of his. Not sure I will get to his standard but still hopeful I can get a decent car with enough effort.

aaronjb
28-05-21, 10:43 AM
You're making amazing progress Chris! Still putting me to shame :)

Boy those must be loud with a capital L, though! Teeny tiny silencers in comparison to a Cobra.

I'm following a guy on Instagram who is mid-build on a Superformance GT40 and he had a really interesting idea when it came to silencing the car: https://ruffiancars.com/gt40/f/exhaust-1
Basically, he's turned the original FIA "luggage boxes" into silencers that are in-line for everything besides wide-open throttle - it should be nice and restrained most of the time, and ear splitting on command :)

Grumbleweed
28-05-21, 11:44 AM
"https://ruffiancars.com/gt40/f/exhaust-1" wow! What an engine! Should be for $22,600 i guess...

Great work Chris!

aaronjb
28-05-21, 11:48 AM
"https://ruffiancars.com/gt40/f/exhaust-1" wow! What an engine! Should be for $22,600 i guess...

Yeah I think his budget might be a little different than even the most affluent members here .. it appears to be "bottomless"! Heck, he has a 3D printer with a 4x4 print bed. That's measured in feet (your average home printer is ~12"x12", large format stretches that to ~18"x18").. approachable guy on social media, though :)

ChrisP
28-05-21, 12:02 PM
You're making amazing progress Chris! Still putting me to shame :)

Boy those must be loud with a capital L, though! Teeny tiny silencers in comparison to a Cobra.

I'm following a guy on Instagram who is mid-build on a Superformance GT40 and he had a really interesting idea when it came to silencing the car: https://ruffiancars.com/gt40/f/exhaust-1
Basically, he's turned the original FIA "luggage boxes" into silencers that are in-line for everything besides wide-open throttle - it should be nice and restrained most of the time, and ear splitting on command :)
Well I’m retired remember, and it’s been too wet for beekeeping! (That’s true but boy are we all in a mess now, bees swarming everywhere!!)
Interesting thread, will take a look at that. A GT40 with a 302 can’t be as noisy as a 427 with an exhaust exiting right by your ear can it??? Joking aside, it will be interesting to see how it sounds with the crossover exhausts. Tornado do a ‘megaphone’ version too. One reason I kept the 302 was for the short stroke, same as my 427, which is not stroked up at all, it’s a different sound ( to the average nerd that is!!)
Now for a serious point, to all of you V8 guys out there still young enough to have decent hearing, these cars/engines do bugger it up unless you protect your ears. After a lifetime of it (and all the grinding and drilling that goes with it) my ears are knackered. I have no hearing at all in the upper quartile. So wear protective gear or end up with hearing aids like me! Mind you, they are good for the phone, audio books and listening to the radio!!!
Whatever though, you can’t beat the sound of a good loud V8 can you!!!!
Looking forward to firing the 40 up now!

aaronjb
28-05-21, 12:15 PM
In my defence, a lot of time has gone into the house recently - when I finally take some car update pics I'll get one of the front room, too.. knocked a wall back to bare break and now replastered (OK, I paid someone to do the plastering, that's a skill!).

Speaking of hearing .. my right ear hasn't gone back to normal yet after I cut through the 1930s steel electrical conduit (filled with rubber & cloth covered wiring) with one of those reciprocating saws yesterday!

Darnpistonbroke
28-05-21, 02:29 PM
Those exhaust stacks look magnificent. Nothing like a well engineered set of curly tubes. It worth building a GT40 just to show off the pipes!

kdavies3
28-05-21, 02:30 PM
Do I gather that the exhaust manifolds that came with the car weren't suitable after all your mods?

ChrisP
28-05-21, 02:57 PM
Do I gather that the exhaust manifolds that came with the car weren't suitable after all your mods?
Three issues with them, 1 very heavy, 2 don’t cross over so not the GT40 sound! and 3 they don’t fit the MK1 body!!!!!!

Happy Jim
28-05-21, 05:40 PM
I concur with the hearing bit! No1 son bought a house with a workshop- I bought 2 pairs of ear defenders and 2 pairs of safety glasses for him/me when in the shop, he thought it a bit soft......then tried them on and now uses them all the time thankfully.

ChrisP
03-11-21, 05:07 PM
After bit of a lay off due to both children (adults!) requiring my building services on properties, I have managed to get some time on the GT40 at last. Feel like I have taken a massive step forward today. A mate who is an ex circuit racer and suspension geometry expert has been all over the car with his gauges, tools and bits of string!! He also had a cracking book - I should have made a note of the title!

After some fettling we are now confident we can get her to handle. I need to alter the steering rack but to be honest I wasn't happy with that anyway. I can now take the opportunity to junk the BMW rack and go for something more suited to the car. As it was, bump steer would have been a major issue, so it has to change. other than that the front end is really quite good. Whoever made this set up must have had some decent knowledge. A good point to start from, all I need to do is fine tune and fettle a few bits including some bracing diagonals to firm things up a bit.

The rear is also good. No bump steer here at all. A few thou of movement only. I am going to alter the lower tie rod to get a straighter pull as the current one has a massive crank in it. Also some bracing to do and some left and right threads to fit to existing tie rods to make future fine adjustment possible without too much hassle. All in all a good set up which I can make really good with a little work.

I'm really pleased. I now have the confidence to press on in the knowledge that all my hard work should at least get me a car that I can drive!! Still a lot to do but onwards............and without the expense of a new Tornado Monocoque which I confess, I was truly tempted by, they do make a super car!!! But that would be too easy!!

aaronjb
03-11-21, 05:25 PM
Excellent to hear of progress again, Chris! Looking forward to this one being on the road :)

I found myself looking at the Tornado website recently - I stopped when I saw the price of the monocoque. Somehow Louise managed to sneak "I'm not sure if I can support another kit car at this point" into her wedding vows, too...

ChrisP
03-11-21, 05:50 PM
Excellent to hear of progress again, Chris! Looking forward to this one being on the road :)

I found myself looking at the Tornado website recently - I stopped when I saw the price of the monocoque. Somehow Louise managed to sneak "I'm not sure if I can support another kit car at this point" into her wedding vows, too...

Andy Sheldon of Tornado has been really helpful to me. I should have my exhausts this week too! They are giving them to me tacked up so I can alter to fit my 'bespoke' car and then they will finish them and get them ceramic coated. Seats are in production too, that allows me to finalise cabin layout. I have their wiring loom already.

Their monocoque is amazing. The car that Dave has built (he's one of the guys at Tornado) is totally amazing. I really would like one but to move to that from where I am is a massive cost as it would mean new suspension and everything as all my stuff is BMW and bespoke to my chassis.

Ian C
03-11-21, 06:59 PM
. . . A mate who is an ex circuit racer and suspension geometry expert has been all over the car with his gauges, tools and bits of string!! He also had a cracking book - I should have made a note of the title!

Chris,

It wasn't Allan Staniforth's "Competition Car Suspension: A Practical Handbook" by any chance was it? If it wasn't then I recommend the book as required reading.

I am following your build thread with interest & envy, keep it up and don't leave such big gaps in future - make the kids wait!


Take care,
Ian

aaronjb
03-11-21, 07:04 PM
I just looked for that on Amazon and .. corks, that's expensive: https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Competition-Car-Suspension-Staniforth-18-Oct-2006/dp/B012HVWJ8K/

KevinW
03-11-21, 07:29 PM
This thread, and Youtube, have forced me to watch loads of GT40 videos!

I have recently been watching this:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsFPTW6E8qt-5iU517lG5XQ

and then this one:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2liZfU2xxE

led me to this....
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=47&t=1221958&i=0

So that's a few more hours I won't be getting back :-P

Aaron - hope the wedding was all good.

ChrisP
03-11-21, 07:30 PM
Chris,

It wasn't Allan Staniforth's "Competition Car Suspension: A Practical Handbook" by any chance was it? If it wasn't then I recommend the book as required reading.

I am following your build thread with interest & envy, keep it up and don't leave such big gaps in future - make the kids wait!


Take care,
Ian



It was Ian, yes, that's the one. Looked a marvelous piece of work for sure. A bargain at £265 Aaron!!!!!!

It was a well used copy, to be honest I think Martin knew it word for word anyway! He's gone away to put the measurements in to a CAD program to run a few more calcs but we are confident the car is good to go. I just need to build the bloody thing!!

jon1d
03-11-21, 09:04 PM
I would expect him to come round and set up the suspension for that amount. Lol

aaronjb
05-11-21, 10:48 AM
Aaron - hope the wedding was all good.

Thanks Kevin - it was a great day, everything went off (almost) without a hitch.. I didn't reply on Facebook as we weren't posting about it on FB ;) most of my friends know we got married but lots of hers don't, and we're still inviting them all to the 'wedding' next year :)


A bargain at £265 Aaron!!!!!!

I think I could get Centre Gravity or Northampton Motorsport to set the suspension up for less than the cost of the book .. but only because folks are taking the pee with the cost of a (presumably) out of print book :(

ChrisP
08-11-21, 02:23 PM
Had a day in the workshop! Having picked up the exhausts from Tornado (while still uncoated) I can try to get over the clutch slave cylinder which is mightily close to Number 2 exhaust

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39849&stc=1
http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39850&stc=1

That is clearly going to be an issue!!!! I need to try to get some clearance and still be able to get the pipe out through the exhausts without being totally boiled. If I can get some clearance then I can use some insulating material and hopefully things will be OK.

So, there are three things I can do, dent the exhaust a bit (brutal but it is out of sight!), get a bit of slack on the whole system by opening up the manifold bolt holes a mm and remove a bit of material to allow the pipe to clear.

I went for all three!

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39851&stc=1
Every little helps!!

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39852&stc=1
Got me a few more mm

ChrisP
08-11-21, 02:26 PM
Then stuck the system on................

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39853&stc=1

It's going to look great! Having just an extra mm in the manifold allowed me to lift the whole system just a bit to clear the slave cylinder.

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39854&stc=1

When it's all ceramic coated gold it should look the part....

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39855&stc=1

Chris1
08-11-21, 03:07 PM
Ignoring all of the touch condition problems (opportunities) that you have, the twin megaphones
look the part and I'm sure they will sound as they should .
Have a look at the the set up that was on the mk1 super van that was used with a Weslake set up
back in the day .Also had a bit more room to play with !
Just look up the Weslake super van and see the 7 minute clip on it, I thought it was great, it might
give you some ideas or you may have already seen it .
Chris.

ChrisP
08-11-21, 04:53 PM
Ignoring all of the touch condition problems (opportunities) that you have, the twin megaphones
look the part and I'm sure they will sound as they should .
Have a look at the the set up that was on the mk1 super van that was used with a Weslake set up
back in the day .Also had a bit more room to play with !
Just look up the Weslake super van and see the 7 minute clip on it, I thought it was great, it might
give you some ideas or you may have already seen it .
Chris.

Hilarious! I had no idea! Not heard of that at all but very good. I hope mine sounds as good as that one!

Link for others if interested
https://www.goodwood.com/grr/race/historic/2020/5/video-the-original-v8-ford-supervan-was-a-gt40-wearing-plumbers-overalls/

psh
13-11-21, 12:22 PM
Sounds like you have made quite a bit of progress since I came down in the cobra during the summer to look at your GT40 project and was really impressed when I saw your modifications to the chassis and the work you had put into the engine and have to admit I am still ever so slightly envious having seen your incredibly well equipped cavernous workshop. Really looking forward to that ride out when its finished Chris :grin:

ChrisP
13-11-21, 06:25 PM
Sounds like you have made quite a bit of progress since I came down in the cobra during the summer to look at your GT40 project and was really impressed when I saw your modifications to the chassis and the work you had put into the engine and have to admit I am still ever so slightly envious having seen your incredibly well equipped cavernous workshop. Really looking forward to that ride out when its finished Chris :grin:
Moving slowly forward Paul! Whatever size, a workshop is never big enough!!
I’m looking forward to driving it too! First start up will be exciting (or disappointing!)

ChrisP
15-11-21, 05:01 PM
Got the suspension design sorted - this is what we are doing

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39870&stc=1


http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39871&stc=1

Should all work OK. I now have the new Ford steering rack and am in the process of working out how to mount that in accordance with the design and to give myself some adjustment to dial out any bump steer (although if I get it in as above it should be good to go)

I've got a couple of track rod ends on order but I may have some fettling and welding to do to get the Ford ends on to the BMW arms and with enough adjustment. I may have to either lengthen the Ford ends or re tap the rods on the BMW ends to M14 x 2 to go on the Ford rack. I will be able to work out the best way once I have the parts.

simon
16-11-21, 09:17 PM
I wish I’d known you wanted a set of zorsts! I’ve got a full s/s crossover setup for sale that won’t fit my GTD because it was made for a car with a lowered engine………
got my work cut out with my project……..

https://www.instagram.com/p/CWT8sd2Aawo/?utm_medium=share_sheet

39878

ChrisP
16-11-21, 09:43 PM
Timing is everything Simon!!! Not to worry. You definitely have some work to do too! We are on similar paths it seems

simon
16-11-21, 10:32 PM
It does, that’s what 14 years under a tarp does to a car!

simon
17-11-21, 07:10 AM
Ignoring all of the touch condition problems (opportunities) that you have, the twin megaphones
look the part and I'm sure they will sound as they should .
Have a look at the the set up that was on the mk1 super van that was used with a Weslake set up
back in the day .Also had a bit more room to play with !
Just look up the Weslake super van and see the 7 minute clip on it, I thought it was great, it might
give you some ideas or you may have already seen it .
Chris.

just out of interest, this is the restored chassis (it’s mainly Cooper F1 chassis, not gt40) of the original Ford Supervan at Hayward and Scott in Essex having a new exhaust fitted…..(first pic is “back in the day”, second is the H&S)
39879

philbrad73
17-11-21, 05:52 PM
I just looked for that on Amazon and .. corks, that's expensive: https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Competition-Car-Suspension-Staniforth-18-Oct-2006/dp/B012HVWJ8K/

I think I may have got the last new hard copy from Italy, £50 Inc the postage. Once I've finished my extension and get back on to the sumo's suspension.

ChrisP
22-11-21, 09:20 AM
I needed a bit of inspiration on these dark evenings so here is a pic of where I am trying to get to (if it ever gets built!!). Something like this is in my head........

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39883&stc=1

A period livery albeit not correct for a GT40. If I am going to upset the woke mob with big V8 I might as well promote smoking too!!!

Chris1
22-11-21, 09:57 AM
I needed a bit of inspiration on these dark evenings so here is a pic of where I am trying to get to (if it ever gets built!!). Something like this is in my head........

http://www.cobraclub.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=39883&stc=1

A period livery albeit not correct for a GT40. If I am going to upset the woke mob with big V8 I might as well promote smoking too!!!
If you go the whole James Hunt route that would really upset the woke brigade, although I wouldn't advise that
as he didn't last very long but I'm sure it was good while it lasted !
By the way the J P S colour scheme was one of my favourites although it never promoted me to smoke.
At the time I liked the freedom of choice back then .
Chris.

KevinW
22-11-21, 10:07 AM
I thought JPS was black and gold?
Not so keen on those wheels...but each to his own.

At least you've got a GT40 and I havent...so I'm jealous.

aaronjb
22-11-21, 11:17 AM
At least you've got a GT40 and I havent...so I'm jealous.

He's got a GT40 and a working FE powered Cobra. Imagine how I feel! :lol: ;)

JPS makes a change from the usual Gulf colours and it's one of my favourites from the era (never smoked a day in my.. ok, tried once, didn't agree with me) but I don't know well it works with such a large expanse of black? Maybe I'm just used to seeing it on much 'smaller' cars? I'm sure it'll look great in the flesh, though!

rpm015
22-11-21, 12:15 PM
That will look fantastic!

ChrisP
22-11-21, 04:04 PM
Haha, guys, yes, I am a lucky fella (especially since I paid £300 for my 427 FE!! - it was 40 years ago and £300 was a fair bit of money to me then!)

Yes, black and gold. It seems 'gold' covers a wide spectrum but I will go fairly near the original JPS colour. I am waiting for my ceramic coated exhausts to come back and will see how that 'gold' looks. They might dictate the shade I go with.

I think it will look OK, others have also expressed concern on the black but I am good with it. Not looking at those wheels specifically. Something more period but with gold centres was my thought. Plenty of time for evolution yet!

Have been mocking up steering again today. I think I now have a working set up that will also give me a good steering wheel position and function. I need to tip the rack slightly to get the geometry for the column at it's best and to avoid my inboard coil overs. Got to start bracketry and work it through now. Plan is to start from the bottom (rack) and take it from there now I have the position sorted. The challenge with this chassis is I have no reference points - I am having to start the set up from scratch. I was also struggling to get the column to exit in the right place in the Tornado dashboard but I think I have it cracked now! I will set the rack a little low to allow it to be shimmed up or down to get optimum position for bump steer and still allow me to play around with ride heights etc. as the suspension is entirely adjustable. The next one will be easy!!